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From: olsen@XN.LL.MIT.EDU (Jim Olsen)
Newsgroups: news.groups,news.admin
Subject: Re: moderated "newsgroups" group
Message-ID: <1443@xn.LL.MIT.EDU>
Date: 21 Jun 89 20:33:11 GMT
References: <3400@ncar.ucar.edu> <11945@bloom-beacon.MIT.EDU> <1989Jun12.181910.10977@twwells.com> <3484@ncar.ucar.edu> <1441@xn.LL.MIT.EDU> <3494@ncar.ucar.edu>
Reply-To: olsen@xn.ll.mit.edu (Jim Olsen)
Organization: MIT Lincoln Laboratory, Lexington, MA
Lines: 29

>> [me] It is far preferable for the moderator to simply ensure that the
>>only things appearing in the newsgroup group are in fact newsgroup
>>proposals, and let the voters decide whether the guidelines have been
>>followed sufficiently for that case.

> [Greg Woods] If this is what everyone wants, I'll go for it, but the
>problem with this is that everyone thinks their own pet newsgroup
>proposal is special. If one person is allowed to violate the guidelines,
>then everyone will want to.  In that event, there is little point in
>having the guidelines at all.

Greg is mistaken.  Most people *will* follow the guidelines, since they
make sense in the large majority of cases.  Right now, everyone is
'allowed' to violate the guidelines, but very few do (except those
completely oblivious to them, who don't bother with proposals anyway).

Routine proposals which gratuitously violated the guidelines would be
rejected by the voters.  On the other hand, extraordinary proposals should
not be hobbled because the guidelines did not anticipate them.

> [regarding the recent guideline revision] On what issue was there no
> consensus?

When no vote was taken, arguments about 'consensus' in a past discussion
are pointless and irresolvable.  I'm not trying to impugn Greg's motives;
I thank him for undertaking the guideline revision.  I'm just trying to
point out that the guidelines are a necessarily imperfect framework.  We
must ensure that the newsgroups system provides the needed flexibility,
and avoids a bureaucratic straitjacket.