Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!mailrus!iuvax!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: mls@mhuxu.att.com (Michael L Siemon) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: secondary causation Summary: the most unkindest god of all Message-ID: Date: 17 Aug 89 07:49:08 GMT References: Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories Lines: 42 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article , stg@ihlpl.att.com (Scott T Grant) writes: > In article , mls@mhuxu.att.com (Michael L Siemon) writes: > [Stuff about pre-destination deleted for space] > Sorry, I just can't buy into this bit about God. I also don't believe > he can be the kind and loving God you portray. Given that God is omnipotent > and knows everything that has/is/will happen in the universe we can then > take it one step further. God knows, from the time of a persons birth, even > before, where that soul is bound. Yet he lets them be born, live and die only > to go to hell and thus give him greater glory.....don't sound like the kind > of God I would be abasing myself to in servitude. I'm not sure why my note elicited this diatribe. For one thing, I was questioning the point of predestinarian doctrines, not supporting them. Scott seems to be projecting an image *he* has about Christian belief -- not an uncommon one for children "raised Christian" (but ineptly so) to have, but that only confirms my suspicions about "religious education" forced on the young. For the record, I do say that God is loving, but I have never described God as "kind" -- nor as "gentle" "meek" or "mild" except (under some protest) in singing Christmas carols. I do not "abase" myself before God; and insofar as I am in servitude to God, that is glorification and not abasement. To give God glory is to be an (adoptive) child of God and no longer a forced servant (which describes rather those who *will* not accept God's offer of love; *they* are reduced to being vehicles of God's -- often very *un*kind -- will.) The dove descending breaks the air with flame of incandescent terror ... Love, Love is the unfamiliar Name that weaves the intolerable shirt of flame ... -- Michael L. Siemon I find it important in philosophizing to cucard!dasys1!mls keep changing my posture, not to stand att!sfbat!mls for too long on _one_ leg, so as not to standard disclaimer get stiff. -- Ludwig Wittgenstein