Path: utzoo!attcan!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!mailrus!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!pt.cs.cmu.edu!a.gp.cs.cmu.edu!koopman
From: koopman@a.gp.cs.cmu.edu (Philip Koopman)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.forth
Subject: Re: Cost of Forth Chips
Summary: Harris listens (sometimes)....
Keywords: stack, risc, chips, sc32
Message-ID: <5965@pt.cs.cmu.edu>
Date: 24 Aug 89 14:57:15 GMT
References: <893@mtk.UUCP> <13199@well.UUCP> <896@mtk.UUCP> <13306@well.UUCP>
Distribution: usa
Organization: Carnegie-Mellon University, CS/RI
Lines: 40

In article <13306@well.UUCP>, jax@well.UUCP (Jack J. Woehr) writes:
> 	At VESTA TECHNOLOGY INC. we agree with you. That's what we
> do for a living, we match would-be inventors and garage geniuses with
> single board Forth computers. Right now it's the 8088 and 80188.
> I have the 68000 and 68008 on my desk, when the manuals get written
> we'll sell them.
> 	We've tried to convince Harris and SC to see the light as you
> have seen it; so far, little luck. When the chip prices come down, we'll 
> sell you your single-board RTX or SC-base computer.
> 	Are you listening, Harris? :-)

Some of Harris is listening -- sometimes.

Right now, Harris offers the RTX-DS hardware/software package.
It comes with a cross-compiled Forth.  A ROM-resident Forth
that executes on the RTX hardware (i.e. a "real" Forth) is
also in the works.  So, what's wrong with these?  I don't mean
to say that they are perfect -- I really want to know what's
wrong.  Right now Harris management says "we have never had
any complaints about the fact that RTXDS is cross-compiled".
Somehow, I find that difficult to believe -- I know *I* wouldn't
want to use a cross-compiler for Forth!  A few dozen complaints
via e-mail might help change that.

More to the point, who in the user community has a suggestion
for what type of development systems would be useful?  Do you
really think that people would live with a KIM-like interface
these days (yes, I have used a KIM, and times are different now)?
What about cost -- how expensive or cheap?  Remember, you tend
to get what you pay for.  What about software tools -- they
can run up development costs a *lot*?

I'm open to suggestions.  I can't guarantee that I will influence
anything, but it's worth a try.

  Phil Koopman                koopman@greyhound.ece.cmu.edu   Arpanet
  2525A Wexford Run Rd.
  Wexford, PA  15090
Senior Scientist at Harris Semiconductor.
I don't speak for them, and they don't speak for me.