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From: jans@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM (Jan Steinman)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Subject: Re: Questions from a novice on development environments...
Message-ID: <6023@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM>
Date: 29 Sep 89 18:13:08 GMT
Organization: Tektronix Inc., Beaverton, Or.
Lines: 39

<<jsv@hpsad.HP.COM (Jeff Vetter)>>
<<Should I forget Smalltalk and try C++ instead?  There seem to be a little 
more support (ie. books and development environments) for C++.>>

You've found a development environment for C++?  I'm impressed!  The best I've 
seen is some combination of gnumacs, gdb, cscope and g++.  (This might change 
when Cynergy is released, but not on a hacker's budget.)

<pick@sdsu.edu (Dan Pick)>
<...In other words, if you're trying to get code up and running quickly, forget 
Smalltalk.  On the other hand, if you really want to learn object-oriented 
programming, I highly recommend it.>

If you're trying to get code up and running quickly, forget C++.  On the other 
hand, if you really want to learn object-oriented programming, forget C++.  If, 
however, you will be forced to work for a living in a profession that is 
increasingly enamored of trendy ideas shoehorned into old languages that really 
don't adequately support new concepts, by all means use C++.

Okay, serious now.  (Did I somehow forget the little smiley face up there?)  
You seem to have some schizophrenia here.  If you want to learn OOP, by all 
means learn Smalltalk first, so that you'll properly use C++ (and recognize and 
avoid its numerous warts) when the time inevitably comes.  If you want to 
develop stand-alone application products, forget both of them and stick to a 
language you already understand well, because you don't really want to be 
sitting in two unrelated problem spaces when you're getting a product out.

There are major commercial applications out there in Smalltalk.  They tend to 
be in the form of easily customizable "application templates", rather than 
canned, "what you see is what you get" programs.  Once you understand both 
Smalltalk and C++, you will be able to "get code up and running quickly" about 
4 to 10 times faster in Smalltalk than in C++.  And by the time you include 
modern user interface libraries and debugging information, a C++ application is 
often larger and slower than a comparable Smalltalk application.

							   Jan Steinman - N7JDB
						  Electronic Systems Laboratory
					Box 500, MS 50-370, Beaverton, OR 97077
						(w)503/627-5881 (h)503/657-7703