Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!snorkelwacker!mit-eddie!husc6!osgood!elkies
From: elkies@osgood.harvard.edu (Noam Elkies)
Newsgroups: comp.music
Subject: Re: Bartok [Re: tunings, cont'd]
Message-ID: <3329@husc6.harvard.edu>
Date: 4 Dec 89 01:17:06 GMT
References: <various> <3068@husc6.harvard.edu> <6335@merlin.usc.edu> <3113@husc6.harvard.edu> <6460@merlin.usc.edu> <3194@husc6.harvard.edu> <6540@merlin.usc.edu> <3246@husc6.harvard.edu> <6676@merlin.usc.edu> <3288@husc6.harvard.edu> <461@obs.unige.ch>
Sender: news@husc6.harvard.edu
Reply-To: elkies@osgood.UUCP (Noam Elkies)
Organization: Harvard Math Department
Lines: 24

In article <461@obs.unige.ch> bartho@obs.unige.ch (PAUL BARTHOLDI) writes:
'In article <3288@husc6.harvard.edu>, [Iwrote:]
'>                      ... By the way, it is sometimes possible to separate
'> the perception of the "rest of the sound" from the initial attack, as has
'> been demonstrated (on the piano) by Bartok a long time back.
'> 
'> --Noam D. Elkies (elkies@zariski.harvard.edu)
'>   Department of Mathematics, Harvard University
'
'Do you mean musical demo, or textual ?  
'Could you give me (us) some reference on this point by Bartok ?  

Musical demo; for instance the end of the second of the Two Roumanian Dances.
A simple variation of that: play a loud cluster, holding the pedal down; return
soundlessly to a subset of the cluster; release the pedal.  That subchord will
be perceived without the initial attack.  Or, hold a chord silently with the
right hand, and strike the same chord an octave down staccato with the left.
Provided your piano is tuned, you'll hear the upper chord sustained without
an attack (the undamped strings resonate with the octave overtones of the
bottom chord).  What happens if you hold down the G an eleventh below middle C
and strike the A#-B-C cluster directly above that G?  [Your mileage may vary.]

--Noam D. Elkies (elkies@zariski.harvard.edu)
  Dept. of Mathematics, Harvard University


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