Path: utzoo!attcan!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!bischeops!nick
From: nick@bischeops.UUCP (Nick Bender)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Subject: Re: HP Customer Support
Summary: Ditto.
Message-ID: <385@bischeops.UUCP>
Date: 1 Dec 89 15:29:06 GMT
References: <221@cmic.UUCP>
Lines: 63

In article <221@cmic.UUCP>, garvey@cmic.UUCP (Joe Garvey) writes:
> 
> The gist of this is that, the experienced user gets short-changed in
> response center support. This doesn't show up in surveys, because they
> are a minority! But it does alienate some of HP's best assests. I value
> the opinions of the experienced system operators that aren't HP (HP too,
> but they're always suspect ;-)). But HP drives these people away. I value
> a system more highly, the more experienced users there are... kinda like
> having shepherds for the flock. They solve problems and fill in when HP
> can't. They lend the system credibility... their presence, their use of
> a system indicates it's viable and useful. It's a much better guide than
> advertising. (It's one of Sun's best assets!)

I very much agree with this. Several times over the last year of using HPUX I
have stumbled across things that make me want to ask "is anyone *really* using
this stuff?" One example is the ommision of <sys/wait.h> which was 
"inadvertently left off the HP-UX 6.2 release." This does *not* give me a warm
fuzzy fealing.

> to their customers... I believe HP has real problems advertising to Sun
> sales reps the problems with HPUX... but if it only went to HP customer sites,
> and wasn't propagated beyond that... maybe HP wouldn't have a problem.

Hiding problems from users is not a win for anyone. Every time I discover a
bug in HPUX it has probably taken me at least a day to isolate it and make sure
that it is HP's problem and not mine. How many times is this repeated at other
HP sites?

> This would allow bugs to be posted, bug fixes to be circulated, HP to have
> archives of unsupported/contributed software, and provide a slick marketing
> tool too! (I wouldn't mind e-junk-mail from HP..., and from HP's point this
> is a great way to get to the people that fill out the purchase req's for
> more HP equipment!) It also means the 90%+ of the simple questions could
> be answered by other users.... leaving the SE's free to be problem solvers!

This, IMHO, would be a huge win for HP. If such a system were in place I
would read it. Every day. And I would participate, lending my expertise
when appropriate. Here I am offering my services to HP free of charge. All
I ask in return is an HPm supported forum for doing it.

Somone at HP mentioned liability problems for distributing patches (sorry no
reference). Is this really any different from the initial liability if a
bug causes a problem in already running code? Don't you think people are going
to check to see if your bug-fix actually fixes the bug? This argument holds
no water for me, but then again I'm not a lawyer.

I have used the current support system. I think this MPE stuff *sucks*. It's
slow and alien and reminds me of mainframes and IBM. BLECH!

Several times I have *faxed* code to the support center. HP sent me a *tape*
with <sys/wait.h> on it. Come on people, UUCP is what, 10-15 years old now?
 
> HP has always succeeded because it innovates. It's time to innovate in
> customer service.

Innovation? Sun has been on the net for years. HP is still playing catch up
in this market.

> Joe Garvey                       UUCP: {apple,backbone}!versatc!mips!cmic!garvey
> 

Nick Bender
...!uunet!bischeops!nick		nick%bischeops@uunet.uu.net