Path: utzoo!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!mailrus!accuvax.nwu.edu!nucsrl!telecom-request From: John Higdon Newsgroups: comp.dcom.telecom Subject: Re: Speech on Telephone Privacy Message-ID: <2006@accuvax.nwu.edu> Date: 9 Dec 89 09:05:47 GMT Sender: news@accuvax.nwu.edu Reply-To: John Higdon Organization: Green Hills and Cows Lines: 106 Approved: Telecom@eecs.nwu.edu X-Submissions-To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu X-Administrivia-To: telecom-request@eecs.nwu.edu X-Telecom-Digest: Volume 9, Issue 565, message 2 of 5 In article <1911@accuvax.nwu.edu> rsiatl!jgd (John G. De Armond) writes: >Have you ever pulled a credit report on yourself? Yes I have, and what has that got to do with your phone number? My credit report was a surprisingly accurate account of my credit history and was quite detailed. Would you like a copy? >Still another, much more insidious use is by the IRS. They collect >data on lifestyle from this and other databanks, such as mailing lists >so that they can impute an income from lifestyle in the event they >think you pay too few taxes. I am personally very vunerable to this >type attack. By virtue of skillful trading, purchasing and >craftsmanship, I live an apparent lifestyle several multiples of my >actual income. And yet the IRS could use this very personal >information to screw me if they so chose. Again, I fail to see what your tax manipulations have to do with an individual knowing what number you are calling from? Is it because you want to pull some scam involving falsification of who or where you actually are? Sounds to me like you are paranoid about something and for some non-specific reason you are not sure you want anyone to know any more about you than they already do. >What I buy, where I go and who I call are strictly MY PERSONAL >BUSINESS and no one elses. Wrong. What you buy is your credit card company's business, your bank's business, even the IRS's business if you deduct for business purposes. Where you go is generally known by your credit card company. Who you call is known by your telco, your long distance company, and the IRS if you deduct telephone calls. Whenever you use the telephone, your number is given to the long distance company for billing, to the business you called if you used an 800 number, to the information provider if you called a 900 number. These many businesses (some of whom ARE scumbags) already have access to your number. What you seem to be against is the private individual having this same information. >More than adequate means already exist to trap prank and obscene >calls. The only motive that can be assigned to wanting to personally >know the ID of a prankster likely looks somewhat like vigilanteism. That's nonsense. I have already dreamed up some creative things that I will do with my computerized answering machine when the day comes that it is fed callers' numbers. For instance, giving important messages to known friends and business associates, being able to return calls where I couldn't understand the number spoken, etc. Just because you are short-sighted concerning the uses of this technology doesn't mean the rest of us should be deprived of its benefits. >Dammit, my phone exists for MY and my family's convenience and use. >No stranger has any more right to invade my privacy electronically >than they do barging through my front door. Not answering the phone >is NOT an answer. Aside from being driven from a service I pay for, >tragedy can happen by ignoring emergency calls. I found out the hard >way when I was a teenager. I got to spend the night in jail on a bum >bust because my parents were not answering the phone that night. That >we later had that cop's ass handed to us on a silver platter was no >consolation for having to spend a hellish night in a city jail. It sounds like you are carrying a lot of baggage concerning your affairs. Why do you think that your precious unlisted number will be compromised in a world with Caller-ID? Who do you call that will spread it around? If you thought that you didn't want me to have it, for instance, I would invite you not to call me. After all, what gives you the right to bother me if I can't "bother" you? If you are so hung up about all this, get two lines and use the listed one to make calls to those whom you seem to want to call without them being able to call you on your unlisted number. >I insist, no, I demand that a ring on the phone is either someone I >want to talk to or is an emergency. All caller ID will do is allow >slime to discover my phone number more readily. I have more unlisted numbers than you do. I have nine; how many do you have? Am I afraid of Caller-ID? Absolutely not. Those who know me will also tell you that I am a staunch advocate of civil rights, the right to privacy, and that I am a strict constitutionalist. But Caller-ID is not snooping by the government--they don't need it. It is not snooping by big business--they don't need it. It is a useful tool that puts just a little more control of the telephone back into the hands of call recipients. You have yet to convince me why that is undesireable; your obvious paranoia notwithstanding. >Hmm, instead of getting mad, perhaps I should take advantage of the >entraprenural opportunity. Hey guys, how do you think a commercial >automatic redialing service would fly. Why go through all that? Why not just have telco offer "calling number hiding"? Because someone will ask, "why do we have to pay to keep our God-given unlisted number private", and the debate starts all over again. >You know, you dial an access >number to get a dial tone and your call is routed out over the service's >line. You think that this service coupled with an iron-clad contract >to never collect or release calling information would fly? I do. Ah, but the service would know. And after awhile, your paranoia would once again surface and you would wonder if the IRS, or whoever you are hiding from was getting a court order to look at their records. And then what would you do? John Higdon | P. O. Box 7648 | +1 408 723 1395 john@zygot.ati.com | San Jose, CA 95150 | M o o !