Path: utzoo!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!clyde.concordia.ca!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: kilroy@mimsy.umd.edu (Nancy's Sweetie) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: Santa Claus Message-ID: Date: 18 Jan 90 04:20:12 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: U of Maryland, Dept. of Computer Science, Coll. Pk., MD 20742 Lines: 50 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article Kevin Whitley writes about some experiences he had with Santa Claus stories around Christmas, primarily people who have no problems with telling children that Santa is `real' in a way that Snoopy is not%. ------ % - Without getting too much into philosophy of what `exists' and what doesn't, which is often more complex than it seems . . . ------ It struck me as odd that the teachers would object to a creche but then lie about Santa Claus: not only does it seem that non-Christian parents might object to the latter at least as much as the former, I would have a problem leaving my children in the care of people who would lie to them. Anyway, maybe I'm just stupid but I don't see much difference between Santa and any other lie. My thinking goes like this: a) Lying to others is a Bad Thing. (given - see Golden Rule) b) Santa does not `exist'. (my best determination) c) Saying that Santa is `real' is a lie. (definition of `lie' & (b)) d) Therefore, saying that Santa is `real' is a Bad Thing. ( (a) & (c) ) I think the weakest part of this is (a); if one does not believe that lying is a Bad Thing, then there is no problem. (I suppose that one might say lying is okay when the alternative, for whatever reason, is worse. I do not see how this exception applies to Santa, however.) kilroy@cs.umd.edu Darren F. Provine ...uunet!mimsy!kilroy "No, he won't take religion; he says it's got too many flaws. He'll bury your God in the same grave that you gave him for Santa Claus." -- Brad Joyce [For more details on lying, you might want to look at a book on the subject by Sissela Bok. I think the title is "Lying". It's an interesting study by a philosopher. It includes a brief summary of the history of major theological and philosophical views on the subject, and then some detailed examinations of implications, particularly in the context of modern issues such as politics and medical ethics. Bok is apparently part of a group that has been working with doctors on medical ethics. It deals very specifically with "white lies". The conclusion I carry from the book is that "harmless" lies normally aren't. --clh]