Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: djo@pacbell.com (Dan'l DanehyOakes) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: impt -> my life, abortion, etc.. (LONG) Message-ID: Date: 19 Mar 90 06:04:17 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: Pacific * Bell, San Ramon, CA Lines: 96 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article cc59+@andrew.cmu.edu (Caleb Cohen) writes: > One girl, Stephanie, broke down and hugged me.... >...She then decided to talk to me if I promised I would >not talk to anyone else. Caleb, In all charity I fear I must begin with a criticism of your behavior. You accepted this girl's confession under terms of strict confidence. (Whether or not you actually promised to remain silent is irrelevant; by accepting her confession you accepted her conditions: and our Lord said that your word must be your bond.) In publishing her story on the Net -- and with her name attached to in, no less -- you have broken your word given before God. This is wrong; there is no other way to look at it. Nonetheless, what's done is done, and her pain deserves our prayer. Now that the word is out, let us look at how you can best help this girl. Before going further, I must confess that I am not the same "flavor" of Christian as yourself, and, in particular, I don't think abortion is always and invariably wrong. This is after long and prayerful study of the Bible, so please don't start "that argument" again; let us, as Christians, accept each other. I might, under other circumstances, suggest pointing out to Stephanie that many Christians *don't* condemn abortion out of hand, but, given your story, I see and accept that Stephanie believes that what she did was wrong, and that's enough for me. I am not out to change her mind any more than yours. (Still, if it might ease her mind you might consider this tactic.) The question at hand is this: how to help a brother or sister in Christ who has admitted that, prior to their conversion, they have committed an act that they, and you, consider to be unspeakably foul. The first place to look for help (as always) is in the words of our Lord. He said that "the one sin which will not be forgiven is the sin against the Holy Spirit." While just what the "sin against the Spirit" is has been subject to much debate amongst the learned, I don't recall anyone ever suggesting that it referred to abortion. Therefore, this constitutes an unequivocal statement that Stephanie's sin can and will be forgiven if she takes it to our Lord in confession and repentance. >I reminded >her (she is a christian) that this is why Jesus died, for this >particular event. I have to question your tactics here. Pointing out that Jesus died for a particular sin, though it is true, often does more harm than good. If a brother or sister is already feeling the pain of their sin, then reminding them of what Jesus suffered for that particular sin may be too much for them to bear. Souls have been driven away from our Lord's fold in exactly this way. (This is a better tactic for the reprimand of a brother or sister who already believes but persists unrepentant in some sin.) Gently reminding them that the price for their sin has already been paid by our Lord may be more appropriate, but can still be risky. Better is simply to remind her of God's love for them, and to show her that God loves her personally as much as anyone. Remind her of St Paul, "the worst of sinners," who stood by and watched as St Stephen was stoned to death, and yet was saved and became one of the greatest pillars of the early Church. And remind her that it is through God's love that you are here, now, listening to her and caring for her: if not for Jesus' sake, why would you bother with her problems? You've got problems of your own! But God's love works through us to reach out to each other, and here you are. God loves her. >She had not asked for forgivenes and didn't think He >would grant it. She didn't want to pray then. I did again and she then >had to leave with her group. I got her address and phone and gave her >mine and told her to call any time, call collect if she wants. I sincerely hope she does call you. You clearly are a loving child of God and can help this girl a lot. But I'd suggest not calling her again; her family situation sounds bad, and it might brew resentment that would do more harm than good. In God's love, do with all your strength the work God has given you -- but remember also that they also serve who only stand and wait. Patience is a virtue beyond price. Would you offer violence to a well-intentioned virus on its slow road to symbiosis? -- William S. Burroughs, THE JOB Dan'l Danehy-Oakes [EEEEK! I should have caught that. It's an interesting ethical question how far one can spread information given in confidence. I'd say that unless there is a very specific promise to the contrary, consulting a colleague who is similarly sworn to confidentiality is probably OK. But certainly enough detail was given here for the person to be identifiable to others who were at the same meeting. It's common for pastors to talk about situations they've seen, but they generally do this some time later, and remove all personal details. --clh]