Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!van-bc!ubc-cs!cheddar.ucs.ubc.ca!panon From: panon@cheddar.ucs.ubc.ca (Paul-Andre Panon) Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga Subject: Re: Patents (Re: Tetris clones) Keywords: patents, ideas Message-ID: <8025@ubc-cs.UUCP> Date: 28 May 90 22:24:28 GMT References: <9005161119.AA18719@jade.berkeley.edu> <24752@usc.edu> Sender: news@cs.ubc.ca Reply-To: panon@cheddar.ucs.ubc.ca (Paul-Andre Panon) Distribution: na Organization: UBC Computing Centre, Vancouver, B.C., Canada Lines: 77 In article <24752@usc.edu> papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) writes: >In article <9005161119.AA18719@jade.berkeley.edu> FILLMORE@EMRCAN.BITNET writes: >>At the risk of prolonging this thread, I would like to pose a question: >>Since game ideas can't be copyrighted, can they be patented? >>My understanding is that the patent system is there to protect ideas. >>Marco? > >No, you don't want to open another can of worms like "patenting software", >do you? Do you? > >-- Marco Marco may have meant for that to be directed at me since I've sent him mail on the subject. It took me a long time to get around to reply because I've fallen so far behind in reading News (300 articles to go in comp.arch, 100 in alt.security, and one of these days I want to start reading comp.unix.wizards... :-)) "patenting software", from my understanding of the current patent system (admittedly very limited), doesn't exactly thrill me. However, as time goes by and we more fully enter the Information Age, information and, most crucial of all, ideas will be some of the few things which will have real value. Even raw materials and land will probably be secondary in importance. Actual manufacturing processes will increasingly be within the capacity of the individual. Currently bulk processes are out of reach of the individual but, given the Postscript version and an appropriate laser printer, you can make fairly respectable copies of books, and as the price drops it will be cheaper to print your own copy (seen the price of textbooks lately?). Similar capabilities will, over the next 40 years, become possible for an increasingly large number of products, given appropriate raw materials. When the cost of manufacturing/copying a product drops far below the cost associated with amortization of R&D however you run into problems. Software piracy is only the forerunner of what promises to be a much more widespread malaise in an Information Age society where the intrinsic value of an idea itself is not recognized. Somebody who can copy the software for $4 worth of media and the manual for $20 will wonder why it is being sold for $350. Unless the development, production, distribution, and support costs are made clear the price is going to seem exhorbitant (although, admittedly, in many cases it really is overpriced). When widespread piracy occurs however, the incentive to develop software/new ideas drops. This does seem to lead to a vicious circle. What is needed is a mechanism whereby the intrinsic value of ideas is recognized and properly compensated for, but which cannot be abused by companies to prevent competition and forestall progress. There's an old joke which goes "Mathematicians stand on each others' shoulders, Computer Scientists step on each others' toes." What I proposed to Marco was that a process in some ways similar to patenting be established whereby inventors are granted "ownership" of ideas. Yes, even for such basic ideas as the "windows/desktop" metaphor. Anybody who wishes to use those ideas would have to pay the inventor a fee based on the original development costs of the idea (plus some extra $$ for the risk), as determined by an independent panel. However, the inventor would not be able to withhold use from a competitor that was willing to meet the agreed price so that this mechanism could not be used to create monopolies on particular technologies. This process would, admittedly be quite manpower intensive in administration however providing a standardized format (like Income Tax forms :-) ) for evaluating development costs would hopefully help minimize the related overhead. So what do you think? Maybe this should be continued in alt.futures but I don't read that group so please mail me a copy of your replies if you re-direct/follow-up there. BTW: I think discussions on this subject and the A3000 are much more interesting than re-hashing "My argument is better than your argument" shouting matches about software piracy and copy protection. They are symptoms. Try to cure the disease. 1/2 :-) -- Paul-Andre_Panon@staff.ucs.ubc.ca or USERPAP1@UBCMTSG or Paul-Andre_Panon@undergrad.cs.ubc.ca or USERPAP1@mtsg.ubc.ca Looking for a .signature? "We've already got one. It is ver-ry ni-sce!"