Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!mailrus!cs.utexas.edu!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sunybcs!boulder!snoopy!wallwey From: wallwey@snoopy.Colorado.EDU (WALLWEY DEAN WILLIAM) Newsgroups: comp.sys.ibm.pc Subject: Re: Windows-the interface that may never happen... Message-ID: <21993@boulder.Colorado.EDU> Date: 7 Jun 90 15:39:09 GMT References: <4ad6ea11.20b6d@apollo.HP.COM> <9814@sbcs.sunysb.edu> <3528@rex.cs.tulane.edu> Sender: news@boulder.Colorado.EDU Reply-To: wallwey@snoopy.Colorado.EDU (WALLWEY DEAN WILLIAM) Distribution: usa Organization: University of Colorado, boulder Lines: 71 In article <3528@rex.cs.tulane.edu> doerschu@rex.cs.tulane.edu (David Doerschuk) writes: >yet MS is now trying to convince users that its the hot ticket for >PCs big enough to run a real OS (unix) with a real GUI (X-Windows). In my opion, MS Windows is a lot more of a real GUI then X-Windows. By the way Motif for X-windows was developed by MicroSoft and HP for the OSF! It was based on IBM's Systems Application Architechture and used Presentation Manager and Windows as a basis for its look. Basically all they added to the 'look and feel' aspect of it was the 3-D chiseled(sp?) effect. (I think barrowed from NeXT). Now even Windows and OS/2 have the same effect. I use Motif(X-windows) alot here at school, and all in all I think Windows is alot more refined. This appears to be especially true for Win 3.0 from everything that I have read and seen. (I'm still waiting for my update!). As for a real OS, well I'm sure I will start a heated war, but I think (based on the information in the latest MicroSoft Systems Journal and last two PC Magazines) that OS/2 version 2.0 will be more of a REAL OS then UNIX in terms of programming API power and file system and the average Joe American Computer User! One last thing, MicroSoft quite a while back (I think 1988, but not sure) even promised that eventually Windows Aps. will run right along side PM OS/2 Aps. someday. Not even in a "compatibility (penilty) box", but rather MS Windows' windows along side (on top of and under) PM windows. Last but not least, I along with a few editors, think that Windows 3.0 is the start of a new generation of software and rather than being a an alternative to OS/2, it is a part of the migration path to it! As far as cost, if you actually saw, and worked with the Windows Software Development Kit, you would completely understand the cost! (I DO!) Windows does a hell of lot more than X-Windows in terms of what it has to do. X-Windows , to very over simplify, is nothing more than a Networkable device independent windows managerand API and GUI. Windows is that minus Network stuff, but it is also a memory manager, and device independent Printer manager, communications manager, Dynamic Data Exchange manager, etc. Basically it is an increadable operating system enhancer! Also Once TrueType comes out, Windows (and OS/2) will be able to do basically everything PostScript and DisplayPostScript can do and can do it on ANY printer and Any screen! Remember you are getting all of this for a mere $150 (retail)! Some programs like memory managers, other GUI's, postscript interpreters, print spoolers, cost as much or more than windows and do less than 10% of what windows is doing! As far as the Software Development Kit is concerned, it should be more expensive than windows itself! You get about $100 dollars worth of manuals alone! On top of that you get a library and a linker(windows requires a special linker to make the code and static segments load on demand-hence virtual), that is a lot more complex than the ones that come with the compiler! In good UNIXs you are just paying for it up front when you buy the UNIX so you don't see the price in the GUI. [ie SCO UNIX]. I know X Windows itself is free and in the public domain, but it has to do a lot less of what MS Windows has to do (due to UNIX being alot more powerful than DOS), and you paid for the same amount of usability from the operating system rather than from the GUI. I'm sure this post will cause a flame war with alot of people-THIS IS NOT THE INTENT. X-WINDOWS, MOTIF, and UNIX are WONDERFUL also, but I think MS-Windows, and OS/2 are getting almost as good (better???). Also remember that the above comments contain alot of opinions, and that everybody is going to find the system that works the best for them, and that is not going to be the same for everybody. My $0.02 worth...maybe less.... Dean Wallwey ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ All the above comments are my own opinions. I'm not affiliated with any of the companies or products mentioned above.