Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!psuvax1!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: lindborg@goat.cs.washington.edu (Jeff B Lindborg) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: a Christian motif that doesn't make sense to me Message-ID: Date: 5 Jun 90 02:58:49 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: University of Washington Computer Science Lines: 63 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article tbvanbelle@watcgl.waterloo.edu (Terry Van Belle) writes: >In article qpliu@andy.princeton.edu (Quowong Peter Liu) writes: >>``Jesus died for your sins,'' meaning that the Death (and the >>subsequent Miracle) of Jesus allows my sins to be forgiven. >>this idea is not self-evident to me, and what Christians seem >>concentrate on is the gruesome details of the Crucifixion and not why >>such an act causes the sins of a Christian who has Accepted Christ as >>Their Saviour (whatever that means). > >It means that although we deserve hell as punishment for our sins, Do we? You hear this all the time (I did, my entire life) but have you ever realy thought it through? God created man (an argument could be made that we are nothing but pets He created out of bordom) and gave him "free will". Now free will implies a choice. Unfortunatly if you are unfortuante enough to be raised nonchristian or are not able/willing to believe in the god who supposedly created you then you are punished by being sent to hell to suffer for all eternity. This seem fair/just/compasionate to me! Why do you consider this our "just deserts?" >Jesus has died instead, and thus, we are spared from hell if we want. If we are able. Some people just cannot make their minds believe in the myth of a god, no matter how badly they want to. >You can think of it as a fantastically large debt we have run up which >Jesus has offered to pay instead. Remember, part of Christian doctrine >is that he not only was crucified, but also went to hell for a time >(wherever that is). Not quite right. If you run this down he did not go to hell "proper" rather a sort of "holding tank" refered to in the NFS as "Hades"... a bit of a difference. >To accept Christ as your saviour is to admit that: >1) your sins form a huge barrier between you and God, which you are > adding to daily, >2) the eventual result of this barrier is hell, >3) there is no way for you to get rid of this barrier, except by allowing > Jesus to do it. Or coming to the realization that God is, indeed, a fantasy. Christianity is perpetuated by fear and I think this post only strengthens that idea. Fear of hell/punishment/death/satan(tm)/.... If there were no provision for escaping "death" (through heaven) then Christianity would have died long ago. >At least, that's how I always understood it. Probably this is how you were raised to believe it. I was. If you tell a small child that the sun revolved around the earth... what do you think they will believe? >>qpliu@phoenix.princeton.edu >>qpliu@usc.pppl.gov > >Terry Van Belle >tbvanbelle@cgl.waterloo.edu Jeff B Lindborg. Email me, I can help you get over your feelings of superstition and fear.