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From: TJACOBS@cc.utah.edu
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.system
Subject: System 7 talk: Hierarchial Apple Menus
Message-ID: <68207@cc.utah.edu>
Date: 8 Jun 90 19:51:49 GMT
Lines: 107
X-Local-Date: 8 Jun 90 12:51:49 PDT

Hierarchial Apple Menus - In System 7 they have made the Apple menu
configurable by having a special folder in the system folder called the
"Apple Menu Folder". You can put DA's, applications, folders, control panel
objects, and aliases. If you alias a folder it opens up the folder upon select-
ion. 

What I proposed to Apple is that the user be allowed to configure each folder
that appears in the Apple Menu to appear either as a folder or as a hierarchial
menu that pops out to show the contents of the folder. Just like HierDA/damenuz
does. There are GOOD reasons for doing both.

I would like to see my Apple Menu look like this:

-----------------
About Macintosh  |
Set aside Finder |
Set aside Others |
-----------------
Finder           |
TelnetNCSA       |
Word             |
----------------- ------------
Applications >>>>| Word       |
Controls >       | Claris CAD |
DA's >           | Excel      |
Choose >         | Filemaker  |
Quickmail        | MacProject |
Vantage          | NCSAtelnet |
MultiClip        | Stuffit    |
General Controls | -----------
My Work Folder   |
-----------------

And not like this:

About Macintosh
Word
Claris CAD
Excel
Filemaker
MacProject
NCSAtelnet
Stuffit
Virus Detective
Finances DA
QuickMail
Run'R
Vantage
ATView
MultiClip
General
Keyboard
Mouse
Startup Device
ClockAdjust
Keyboard
Kolor
MacEnvy
Monitors
Network
SuperClock
QuickKeys
etc.
etc.
etc.


Now I realize I can do the first without having the folders be hierarchial but
it slows things considerably. I don't want to HAVE to wade through any more
layers of user interface than I have to.

Apple seems to have a definite bias against hierarchial menus and so do I for
many things. I don't like any more levels of hierarchial menus than 2. They've
done tests that show that menus in windows are not as fast as menus at the top
of the screen. Perhaps they have done test relating to hierarchial menus too.

IMHO, button pallets are faster than menus, menus are faster than dialogs, and
hierarchial menus are faster than bringing up a dialog box and choosing a
button. 

Now the issue of Hierarchial Apple Menus was brought up at the developers
conference and the majority of people there boo-ed the subject along with a
few cheering souls. Now I can understand that many people would not like this
feature and would not use it. But why would anyone dissagree with the notion
of allowing the user to choose which way he wants it done? Some will say it
is confusing for new/novice users if some people do it one way and others do it
another, but think about it, if you see a folder menu with a dark arrow at the
end and one without it, can it really be that tought to figure out what the
difference is? Now if a new user looks at the two menu examples above, which
one do you think will look more confusing?

It seems a simple matter to include a checkbox in the info window for folders
to show as hierarchial menus in the Apple Menu.

I solicit your comments on the matter. I would like to hear from those who
favor this approach as well as those who don't. I plan on passing the resulting
discussion on the the Human Interfaces group via Applelink.

The Apple menu is becoming a control center for the whole Mac and I would like
to be able to customize to my liking. Apples step of making it configurable is
a great one, I just think they stopped short of making it faster and more
organized.


Tony Jacobs
Center for Engineering Design
University of Utah