Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!know!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!decwrl!hayes.fai.alaska.edu!accuvax.nwu.edu!nucsrl!telecom-request From: covert@covert.enet.dec.com (John R. Covert 26-Jun-1990 2059) Newsgroups: comp.dcom.telecom Subject: Re: Uniform International Dialing Message-ID: <9317@accuvax.nwu.edu> Date: 27 Jun 90 01:05:30 GMT Sender: news@accuvax.nwu.edu Organization: TELECOM Digest Lines: 74 Approved: Telecom@eecs.nwu.edu X-Submissions-To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu X-Administrivia-To: telecom-request@eecs.nwu.edu X-Telecom-Digest: Volume 10, Issue 457, Message 11 of 12 From: Greg Monti Date: 26 June 1990 Subject: Re: Uniform International Dialing "Spyros C. Bartsocas" writes: (Regarding trying to call Greece via calling card from a pay phone in Boston:) > To my > surprise after the thanks for using AT&T recording, an AT&T operator > answered the phone. She said that I could not use my calling card to > dial that country from that payphone. So I moved to another one, > tried again, same thing. This time the operator said that the country > I am calling has disabled calling card calls. This does sound right > to me. Trying the same thing from a hotel room was successful. Can > anyone explain the above? Because other countries (and long distance companies in the United States) *do* have the right to reject, out of hand, the credit of callers from or to certain other countries. I guess that Greece does it because of previous problems with fraud, in which they spent money to complete calling card (01+) calls into Greece and then found that the LD company(ies) which sent the calls had been defrauded and that no money was ever collected so they never got their share. If you call AT&T International Long Distance Information (800 874-4000) (this is *information*, not *directory assistance*) they can probably send you a booklet on international calling. There's a chart in it showing, for every country on earth, whether they accept direct dialed calls to or from the USA and whether the countries accept calls made with calling cards from each other's country. Last version I saw was being given out at an AT&T booth at a convention center in early 1990, but the instructions in it seemed to be several years old (like no direct dialing to Soviet Union). The hotel probably used an AOS to take your card number, direct dialed the call itself, and then paid the bill for direct dialed call from the money it got from you when you paid the AOS charge as part of your local phone bill. There's a lot less fraud in direct dialed calls than in calling card calls, so the direct dialed call was accepted by Greece. You could have probably gone home and direct dialed (011+) the call a lot cheaper from there; but you give up the convenience of using the calling card. Greg Monti, Arlington, Virginia; work +1 202 822 2633 Addendum from John Covert: Actually, the AT&T operator who stated that it was the other country that wanted the calls stopped is mistaken. Since it was AT&T calling cards that were involved, there is no bilateral agreement involved. What's actually going on is that AT&T (and other carriers) are red-lining certain exchanges and countries because of a high volume of calling card fraud from those areas to those countries. AT&T accepts the AT&T (or local telco) calling cards for calls to all countries served by AT&T without exception. At least from non-coin phones. Bilateral agreements only affect whether the AT&T card can be used to call back home from those countries, or whether the distant country's calling card is accepted by AT&T for calls from the U.S. to the distant country. Specific example: last fall, as I was trying to call Hong Kong from JFK airport, I discovered that the exchange containing the NYTel payphones was red-lined. However, the AT&T Card Caller phones nearby were on a different exchange which was not redlined, thus the calls could be placed. /john