Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!samsung!usc!snorkelwacker!bu.edu!dartvax!carr!kurash
From: kurash@carr.dartmouth.edu (Mark Valence)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.misc
Subject: Re: Menu items that change
Keywords: changing menus interface
Message-ID: <23058@dartvax.Dartmouth.EDU>
Date: 6 Jul 90 17:32:27 GMT
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Reply-To: kurash@carr (Mark Valence)
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In article <8997@goofy.Apple.COM> lsr@Apple.COM (Larry Rosenstein) writes:
>In article <23043@dartvax.Dartmouth.EDU> kurash@carr (Mark Valence) writes:
>>
>>By the way, menu items that change (like 'Clean Up Selection' versus 
>>'Clean Up Window' [in the Finder]) are a bad idea (regardless of the

Actually, I didn't write this - you've taken me out of context. Ah, who cares.

>I disagree in this case.  There is no essential difference between the two
>commands (both clean up some set of icons).  Adding the description of what
>is being cleaned up simply clarifies the situation.  

As my original posting states, I also disagree, but for different reasons.
First of all, I do see an 'essential difference'.  In the case of 'Clean Up'
the changing item does not just 'clarify'.  It can actually be changed
by clicking i nthe appropriate place.  I'm sure every Finder-retentive
Mac user (like me) has been frustrated by this item - you go to clean
your window up and - damn, forgot to unselect.

>Another example is the Undo menu item.  I think adding the same of the
>command being undone, and changing the name of the item to Redo (when
>appropriate) is useful for letting the user know what's going on.

Couldn't agree more, in this case the change IS just clarifying - you
can change it by further editting, but it's only there to tell you
exactly what will be Undone.

>>Also, notice that a menu item that changes does NOT have a key
>
>The Undo item does have a key equivalent.  Provided that the essential
>function of the command doesn't change, then there's no reason to prohibit a
>command key equivalent.  

I stand corrected.  Still my above opinions in mind, this command equiv
is slightly different than one for clean-up.

>It would be a bad idea to change one command into another, unrelated
>command.  One should judge the situation based on whether the menu
>organization is good, rather than on whether the name of the item changes.
>Changing the name of a menu item alone, doesn't turn a good menu
>organization into a bad one.

Sound advice, indeed.

>-- 
>		 Larry Rosenstein,  Object Specialist
> Apple Computer, Inc.  20525 Mariani Ave, MS 46-B  Cupertino, CA 95014
>	    AppleLink:Rosenstein1    domain:lsr@Apple.COM
>		UUCP:{sun,voder,nsc,decwrl}!apple!lsr

Just playing devil's advocate.

Mark.