Xref: utzoo comp.lsi:1106 comp.lsi.cad:559 sci.electronics:13156
Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!mailrus!wuarchive!usc!venera.isi.edu!sllu
From: sllu@jenny.isi.edu (Shih-Lien Lu)
Newsgroups: comp.lsi,comp.lsi.cad,sci.electronics
Subject: Re: VLSI Design Tools on PCs
Message-ID: <14440@venera.isi.edu>
Date: 28 Jul 90 00:00:32 GMT
References: <38395@sequent.UUCP> <610@garth.UUCP> <1990Jul27.145255.4742@ameristar>
Sender: news@venera.isi.edu
Reply-To: sllu@jenny.isi.edu.UUCP (Shih-Lien Lu)
Organization: USC-Information Sciences Institute
Lines: 48

In article <1990Jul27.145255.4742@ameristar> rick@ameristar (Rick Spanbauer) writes:
>>At DAC, I saw ISS, Integrated Silicon Systems, with a PC based IC layout
>>system.  Seat cost is 20K, but for a PC, it comes with a graphics card
>
>I am curious why anyone would go to the trouble of doing IC design
>on a PC.  It would seem that unless one is designing $450 Mosis Tiny
>Chips, the fab costs for just one run approach the cost of a workstation, 
>ie if one has the dollars for fab (several runs usually), then it would 
>seem the workstation cost wouldn't be a problem.  Or is it the case that 
>commercial IC design software is just cheaper on PCs as it is for eg PCB
>design software?

Yes.  The hardware cost is nothing, SUN just annouced a low end
color SPARC for < $10,000 (list price, with educational discount you
may get it for ~$6,200.00). However the CAD/CAE tools are still expensive.

Here are some typical prices for Cadence software running on SUN:

frame work ~ $10,000
layout     ~ $20,000
Dracula III~ $50,000

total ==== ~ $80,000

This is the bare minimun. You would want to have schematic capture tools
simulation tool, extraction, and layout verses schematic.
Plus typically CAD/CAE company charge customer 12-15% for maintanence a year.
Just on the minumun software you may spend easily $10,000
(price of a SPARC station) a year on maintenance. Moreover, the software
cost is per seat cost.

I beleive the original question should have been does anyone
know of any AFFORDABLE software tools. I believe most of
the inexpensive tools runs on PC. Aptos (a PCB software company)
has extented their PCB stuff to include IC layout. Their PCB/IC layout
tool cost $750.00 their GDSII output program costs $245.00. You may get a
demo disk by calling (408)662-8364. In my opinion, most of
the PC layout tools are still limited by the DOS memory size of
640K. I believe Tanner Research is coming out with a version that
will use extented memory in protected mode. I do not know if
ICEdit has the extended memory capability. Someone also mentioned
about IC Designs. Does it use extented memory? I know Aptos doesn't at
this time.

It seems like university tools (ie. Magic) are still possible solution although
one has to use them with care.

Shih-Lien