Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!jarthur!usc!rutgers!njin!princeton!TWG.COM
From: lefty@TWG.COM (David N. Schlesinger)
Newsgroups: soc.religion.eastern
Subject: Re: Looking for a philosophy/religion.
Message-ID: <1409@idunno.Princeton.EDU>
Date: 25 Jul 90 13:48:59 GMT
References: <1211@idunno.Princeton.EDU> <1263@idunno.Princeton.EDU>
Sender: mukund@idunno.Princeton.EDU
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In article <1263@idunno.Princeton.EDU> cak0l@surya.cs.Virginia.EDU 
(Christopher A. Koeritz) writes:
> >Mabey I try too hard to understand Zen.  "I have nothing to teach you
> >about Zen", "keep the beginner's mind", and "if you see the Buddha, you
> >must kill him" are the types of phrases that keep coming up.  It seems
> >very elusive and meant to be that way.
>
> i do know one thing-- if people think the expression, "if you see the
> Buddha, you must kill him" is not meant for people to hurt Buddhas.
> that literal action would be one of those seven(?) heinous crimes that
> are supposed to keep one in one or another hell a very long time.
> unfortunately, my understanding does not extend to this sphere,
> although at one point someone told me that if you think you see the
> buddha, kill the conception that you are seeing him.  you are not
> really seeing him, as he really is, for perceptions are flawed at the
> root.  if the fact that you think you have seen the buddha is afflicting
> your mind, kill the thought.  this extends to parents and friends and
> anyone or anything else.  but like i said, i don't really understand it.

"If you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him!" is one of those classical 
Zen sayings that can cause people who take it literally a lot of trouble.  
The point of the saying, as I understand it, is that the Buddha is _you_; 
if you're looking for external buddhas to help you out of suffering, 
you're barking up the wrong tree.  Reliance on a buddha other than your 
own buddha-nature is a snare, and must be avoided to make progress.  
Excessive focus on buddhas, or on enlightenment can block your progress; 
even the idea of "progress" can block your progress.

One of my favorite stories:  A zen monk has been sitting in the zendo, 
meditating, for days and days.  The roshi walks in, watches him for a 
while, and asks: "Why are you sitting there like that?"  "I'm trying to 
become a buddha," the monk replies.

On hearing this, the roshi picks up a tile from the floor and starts 
scraping against a rock, making an incredible noise.  The monk jumps up 
and says, "Why are you _doing_ that!?"  The roshi replies, "I'm trying to 
make a mirror."  Totally exasperated, the monk says, "No matter how long 
you scrape that tile against that stone, you'll never make a mirror out of 
it!"  "No matter how long you sit there with your legs crossed," responds 
the roshi, "you'll never make a buddha out of yourself!"

|<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>|
|           David N. Schlesinger || "When I have nothing to say,       |
|           The Wollongong Group ||  my lips are sealed;               |
| Internet: Lefty@twg.com        ||  say something once,               |
|    DoD #: 0152                 ||  why say it again?" -- David Byrne |
|<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>|