Path: utzoo!attcan!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: ckp@grebyn.com (Checkpoint Technologies) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: Benjamin Britten's pagan? carol Message-ID: Date: 29 Jul 90 18:06:20 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: Grebyn Timesharing, Vienna, VA, USA Lines: 63 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article st0o+@andrew.cmu.edu (Steven Timm) writes: >Some people >have said that some Catholics do believe that we should praise God >for the fall because it lead to the glorification and incarnation of >Christ. >[...] >The carol says that if Adam had not taken the apple "Then had not >Our Lady a been Hevene queen." It's not celebrating Jesus--it's >celebrating the exaltation of Mary. > The notion that the Fall was *necessary* in order for Jesus to become man is *not* part of the Deposit of the Catholic Faith. The Catholic Church has not made a conclusive statement as to whether the Fall was a prerequisite to Christ's Incarnation. However, the Fall, once having occurred, certainly caused Christ's Incarnation to be necessary in order for mankind to be saved. Mary, of course, played an extraordinary role in the Incarnation. She, of all created beings, was given the grace to be Mother of the Redeemer. Because of this special grace, resulting from the anticipated merits of Christ's salvific work, she herself was concieved without the slightest stain of sin, and was further given the grace to be the vehicle through which God became man -- His flesh being generated from her flesh. She is truely "full of grace." It has been often observed that man fell through the "yes" of a woman -- Eve -- to Satan. And likewise, man was saved through the "yes" of a woman -- Mary -- to God. Mary had free will just like the rest of us. And in no conceivable way could it have been considered a *sin* for Mary to have chosen not to take on the obligation (a fairly heafty one at that) that the Archangle Michael was extending to her. She could have quite easily chosen a different way of serving God. But she said "yes" to God's offer: "be it done unto me according to Thy word." And because of her free-will choice, Salvation came to man. So we have much -- everything! -- for which to be thankful to Mary: even the fact of our very salvation. >Do Catholics really believe this was the reason the fall happened? >Do *you* sing "Deo Gratias" because sin came to exalt Mary? Now, if you are wondering if the Fall happened in order to glorify Mary??? Catholics believe no such thing. What an inconceivable idea. No, by no stretch of the imagination could one say that Catholics believe that the Fall happened in order to glorify Mary. Such an idea is the furthest thing from the Catholic faith. Even though we have much to Mary to be greatful for, under no circumstances would Catholics say that the Fall occurred in order to glorify a created being -- Mary. If through Mary God is glorified, then praise God!! But Mary's glorification as an end in itself is a most revolting idea. > >Steve chris -- First comes the logo: C H E C K P O I N T T E C H N O L O G I E S / / \\ / / Then, the disclaimer: All expressed opinions are, indeed, opinions. \ / o Now for the witty part: I'm pink, therefore, I'm spam! \/