Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!samsung!munnari.oz.au!bruce!frank
From: frank@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU (Frank Breen)
Newsgroups: comp.ai
Subject: Re: The Turing Test is no good!
Message-ID: <2882@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU>
Date: 19 Aug 90 15:01:06 GMT
References: <2860@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU> <3156@gara.une.oz.au> <2870@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU> <3211@gara.une.oz.au>
Distribution: comp
Organization: Monash Uni. Computer Science, Australia
Lines: 40

In <3211@gara.une.oz.au> pnettlet@gara.une.oz.au (Philip Nettleton) writes:

>From article>2870@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU>, by frank@bruce.cs.monash.OZ.AU (Frank Breen):

>The problem with this is that YOU are not real. Or rather, you are MERELY
>a machine trying to convince me that you are a human being by posing questions
>that put your own intelligence into question :-). Prove that you are not,
>and we may have some basis for discussion on the Turing Test.

I am not real and I am not human.  There that proves that I am not trying
to convince you that I am :-)

>You see, Searl's experiment means nothing because although Searl, as part
>of the system, knows nothing about Chinese, the system as a whole does.

This was how I first replied to the problem but after reading Searle's
article I'm not so convinced about this.  I just think it is possible
to imitate understanding without actual understanding.  I recently read
about someone teaching chimps a simple language but someone else taught
the same language to some of his (human) students and although they
appeared to understand the language they did not and were basically
doing pattern matching while being ignorant of the real mean of the
language (or even that it was a language).

>[elaborating the systems reply]... If the system could pass
>Turing Test (and this is debatable) then I for one wouldn't argue against
>it being intelligent.

I wouldn't either argue against it's intelligence either - I would give
it the benefit of the doubt.

>Remember, ANY question is fair game.

>-	"What did you have for breakfast?"
[ some more such questions ]

It could lie.


Frank Breen