Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rutgers!ucsd!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!apollo!nelson_p From: nelson_p@apollo.HP.COM (Peter Nelson) Newsgroups: comp.society.futures Subject: RE Feedback on Computer Crime - Apology Message-ID: <4c517e56.20b6d@apollo.HP.COM> Date: 20 Aug 90 20:34:00 GMT Sender: root@apollo.HP.COM Distribution: usa Organization: Hewlett-Packard Apollo Division - Chelmsford, MA Lines: 53 From: bzs@world.std.com (Barry Shein) :The software industry of course points to the cost of developing those :materials, and that's indisputable (although exactly how that relates :to the cost of the product is not very well understood, certainly :there are some enormously profitable software companies out there.) : :The important point is that at this time the software industry is :seeking massive government (i.e. taxpayer) subsidies to ensure these :profit margins, which at least on materials seem fairly large to the :consumer. These subsidies are being sought in the form of police and :court expenses to criminalize anyone who threatens their profits. :We can argue moral niceties about what's right and what's wrong but in :the end, is it fair that we as taxpayers foot this bill? It could be :billions of dollars in investigations, prosecutions, etc. But the "moral niceties" are CENTRAL to the issue. Copying com- mercial software and giving it to our friends either IS or IS NOT stealing. And we have to decide that issue. If it isn't stealing then Mr. Shein is certainly correct in decrying the use of public money to defend these companies. But if it is stealing then these companies have every right to expect the state to protect them. Although Usenet is full of debates about the role of government all but the most minarchist people believe that stopping "theft and fraud" is a legitimate government function. There are certainly other industries which depend on the police for their protection. Banks, for one. And the insurance industry couldn't exist without strong punishment for insurance fraud. The pharmeceutical industry is likewise dependent on vigorous enforcement of patent laws: the real cost many drugs is in the R&D and testing process; often the manufacturing cost is fairly trivial, and it would be easy to copy if other companies could get away with it. :But we also have to ask if it's the industry's responsibility to find :some solution better than merely asking for the govt to spend billions :on enforcing their profits. It's also possible to say, you're right, :but we're not going to spend a lot of tax dollars and chase otherwise :honest citizens around, there's too large a stupidity factor involved. There may not BE a solution, or at least one which consumers would accept. It's easy to say they should do "something" but on the other hand, anyone who DOES come up with a good anti-piracy scheme will get disgustingly rich overnight if it cannot be defeated and is also acceptable to the market. ---Peter