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From: dwp@willett.pgh.pa.us (Doug Philips)
Newsgroups: comp.lang.forth
Subject: Re: CM and GNU
Message-ID: <1689.UUL1.3#5129@willett.pgh.pa.us>
Date: 7 Sep 90 04:38:09 GMT
References: <9009070011.AA16871@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU>
Organization: String, Scotch tape, and Paperclips.  (in Pgh, PA)
Lines: 38

In <9009070011.AA16871@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU>, wmb@MITCH.ENG.SUN.COM writes:

> One might presume that CM might object to using GNU, or indeed to using
> anything written by someone else, on the same grounds.

If CM will only use what CM has personally writen, its no wonder he was
worried at one point about writing more than 40 programs in his life time.

There is a conflict here between "doing it your way" and "doing it so that
many have a chance to share in it too."  In "Thinking Forth," CM suggests
that arrays are an abstraction best left to the individual
problem/programmer to work out.  If that is true, what chance do we have
with a more complicated abstract data type foundation for OOF?

> Note that the GNU project has mostly been doing just what I suggested
> (re-implementing existing and familiar interfaces, not inventing new ones).
> As I recall, in the GNU Manifesto, Richard Stallman said something to the
> effect that Unix isn't the greatest thing in the world, and he could
> probably invent a better system, but Unix has the momentum so he's going
> to implement it.  A compromise that succeeds has much greater value than
> the "greatest thing in the world, but nobody uses it".

Actually I think what GNU is doing is making something better from the
inside out.  Many of the GNU tools go beyound the things they are
replacing.  Whether that is an explicit goal, a hidden agenda, or just
plain good fortune I don't know.  Given the relative number of systems/
programmers/users of Unix versus Forth, its easy to see why compatability
would be a very big concern for GNU.  The other concern that makes the
analogy somewhat flawed is that GNU is not just about replacing Unix
but about freeing intellectual access to software so that any improvements
can be shared by all.  In ten more years will GNU "Unix" really look like
Unix anymore?  (Semi-rhetorical question).

-Doug

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