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From: pcb@cacs.usl.edu (Peter C. Bahrs)
Newsgroups: comp.windows.ms
Subject: Re: Query:  Which would you recommend?  Windows?  or OS2 w/ PM?
Message-ID: <15114@rouge.usl.edu>
Date: 22 Sep 90 05:25:37 GMT
Sender: anon@rouge.usl.edu
Organization: The Center for Advanced Computer Studies, USL
Lines: 70

>From: steveha@microsoft.UUCP (Steve Hastings)
>
>In article <1990Sep19.171840.9384@portia.Stanford.EDU> aaron@jessica.stanford.edu (Aaron Wallace) writes:
>>Right now, though, MS basically got rivals Lotus and Wordperfect to devote 
>>resources to OS/2, then came out with Windows 3 and left them holding the 
>>(empty) bag with no Windows 3 products...
>
>This isn't true.  For seven years, a group of people at Microsoft have been
>...
>long run and said "Forget Windows.  OS/2 is going to blow it away." In the
>long run, this is still true.
>
>There never was a secret plan to trick Microsoft's rivals.  Microsoft has
> ...

Forget rivals, What about IBM?   
...

I have used and programmed serious windows applications for 3.5 years.
I have been very impressed with the look of win3 and performance.  But,
after several months of new development and usage, I must say that 
there are still a lot of bugs win win3.  I say a lot because when
my system crashes when using normal apps (winword, pagemaker, ami) who
am I to blame?  I can never reproduce the errors.  Just suddenly a stupid
unrecoverable error appears and boom!  I don't recall this problem in
win386.  And my systems are 100% IBM.  (btw, I am now experimenting with
Actor development.  I don't need to buy additonal video hardware to 
debug it and I get the benefits of OO programming.  

So I got OS/2 1.3 (I think, version?) with PM and its sdk and I like it.
Why?  Because I don't have a DOS machine sitting there.  No matter how nice
windows gets, DOS is still there.  When win4 or 5 comes out maybe you will boot
them but not DOS;  but this is what OS2 IS!
I am now getting smalltalk for PM development.


What really interesting with a whimsical tone is seeing a non-computer
scientist buy a machine and try to configure windows. HA! now way.
Especially with some of the less popular hardware manufactures.

I guess what I am trying to say is that my tires are loosing air on
the window 3 ride.  I have paid + $1500 for msc 6.0, SDK, win3, QuickC,
winword and others per machine.  In addition, I find that anything
less than 20-25mhz is just too slow to do 6.0 compiles.  Also, 3mb
seems to be a good minimum for memory to keep from swapping so much.
Plus $250 for a video card and debugging monitor.  That ends up
being about $5000 to develope windows applications!  Yes, I have
tried similar 16mhz and less memory but I hate waiting.  (Note: actor
was only $99 and supports all SDK calls).   No one at micrsoft told
me that I need additional hardware to debug win apps when I ordered
the upgrade.  No one told me what I have to do to upgrade my  old apps.
No one told me that I would have to PAY FOR TECHNICAL SUPPORT!!!!!
In fact the whole 'mums the word' mood about windows 3 unoffical
development pisses me off in retrospect.  But I jumped on the
bandwagon.  I think the marketing
reps at microsoft are amazing and deserve a raise.  I sure would want
them working for me.  I wish there were more critical reviews about
win3 vs. Deskview vs. PS2 PM vs. DOS vs...  Reviews including productivity
measures.   But no, what do we have.  Well I have yet to talk to anyone
about win3 at microsoft.  I have made numerous 20 minute calls but
had to hang up.  

I have been an avid windows developer for 3.5 years now, but I feel 
micrsoft has abandoned their faithful developers through cost and 
lack of tech. support.  


GO OS2 PM, GO OS2 PM.  Give me the look and feel of Unix and Motif !!!!!
But please (IBM) don't leave me out in the cold.  Do us right, like
sell PM sdk for < $100 with each OS2.