Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!mailrus!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!ucsd!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: coatta@cs.ubc.ca (Terry Coatta) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: Church and State Message-ID: Date: 25 Sep 90 08:05:04 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Lines: 53 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu John DiMarco writes: > That's not true. The essence of democracy *is* majority rule. Compromise and > consensus only come into play when a majority is desired, but has not been > attained. I disagree strongly on two grounds: (1) Secular: The basis for society has to be a recognition of certain fundamental rights and freedoms. Anything else is tyranny by whatever name you call it. (2) Religious, I personally find it impossible to believe that any Christian would willfully choose to ignore the desires of those who are in the minority. Are we not to love our neighbours, to be charitable, to turn the other cheek? This does not imply that we need always give way to desires of the minority, but we must always consider their desires and needs because they ARE our brothers and sisters. > That's not true either. Religious ideals and justifications have been present > in the political arena since the beginning of time, and compromise and > consensus have not been absent. I find this somewhere between sad and humourous. Almost anywhere that purely religious ideals or justifications have intruded into the political realm have been accasion for recrimination and bloodshead. The crusades, the inquisition, the persecution of the hugenots, laws against witchcraft, and the list goes on. Religious ideals have blended smoothely with government only in more or less homogeneous religious environments, or when religious ideals overlapped significantly with secular ones. > I'm getting a little frustrated with this discussion. Why don't you > just spell out exactly how you propose prohibiting Christians from taking > any democratic positions motivated by their religious beliefs, and we > can investigate how "democratic" this is. I don't propose to prohibit anything. I am asking that as a Christian you behave in accordance with the principles of Christianity when acting in a public forum. Did Christ ask that we legislate Christianity into existence? Did Christ tell us it was OK to pass judgement on what is proper conduct for non-Christians? Did Christ suggest that it was OK to ignore the needs and desires of other people and simply impose Christian ethics on them? That is oppression pure and simple. Is there a commandment somewhere that says ``Thou shalt oppress non-Christians''. And just what exactly is the point of forcing others to ACT according to Christian ideals? Are we saved by ACTING like Christians? If we sincerely want to spread the good news of Christ then I suggest the best way to do that is to treat others courteously, to respect their needs and beliefs, and to present the good news to them as friends, not overlords. Terry Coatta (coatta@cs.ubc.ca) Dept. of Computer Science, UBC, Vancouver BC, Canada `What I lack in intelligence, I more than compensate for with stupidity'