Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!decwrl!shelby!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!remus.rutgers.edu!lcs From: lcs@remus.rutgers.edu (Lyle C. Seplowitz) Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm Subject: RE:C for the 128 Message-ID: Date: 2 Oct 90 15:23:25 GMT Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J. Lines: 66 From piskacrj@mentor.cc.purdue.edu (Robert J Piskac) Sat Sep 29 18:21:51 1990 In reference to article , lcs@remus.rutgers.edu (Lyle C. Seplowitz) >Do you feel this is a fair statement? Commodore no longer sells the >C= 128. Why should Abacus put further money in a product that is >limited in sales. >If you are that great programmer and critic that you think you >are, make the changes to the program yourself. Why is it worthless? >Don't you know how to run programs that you compiled in the shell? >Or is it that you don't like having to load the shell to run a >program. Abacus will let you copy the shell to other disk's. All >you have to do is set the autoexec file to load and run the program >and anyone can run the program. >You have not proved your claim that Abucus Software is not worth >its money. First of all, I never claimed to be a great programmer. I do have enough knowledge of programming to make some of the corrections to Super C 128 myself. Unfortunately, Abacus refuses to provide the information I need to make these corrections. I cannot blindly change a program without enough information about memory management and file formats. Even with this information, I would probably still need the source code to make changes to the linker. A task that isn't worth my effort. The shell and autoexec utilities (which does not work properly when booted from device 9) are too limiting. It also makes Abacus's Super C 128 more of a language extension rather than a real compiler since it is always dependent on the shell. The point I made originally is that the 64 verion has the ability to link C programs to run under BASIC. Why was this left out of the 128 version? Having the autoexec file, which fails to work in all configurations, does not replace the need for independent program development. In fact, with the shell using memory in BANK 0 and the RAM DISK using memory in BANK 1 RAM, there is little room left for most programming projects. I wrote to Abacus numerous times trying to find information about the shell and the RAM DISK. They never provided me with any of this information. What I asked for should not be withheld from registered users that want to customize the shell for their own needs. I used the C compiler for my programming assignments in my computer science courses. For most of those programs, mostly short mathematical assignments, Super C was sufficent (although somewhat outdated and limited from the UNIX version it is based on). For one assignment I had a major problem with the accuracy of double precision numbers. The compiler was very inaccurate and I had to complete the assignment on a UNIX machine. Abacus offered no help in this situation. Yes, I think that Super C 128 is worthless to anyone except those who just want to learn to program in C. Yet Abacus claims their compiler to be a programmer's development tool. I strongly disagree. From other users statements about this and other Abacus languages I cannot recommend that people spend their money on them. About other Abacus products, that was my mistake in condemning them. If you still feel that I haven't "proved" my claim, then I will be glad to post other messages until I have stated my claim to your statisfaction. I offer this information as my own opinion and experience with this product and this company. I stated originally that Abacus is more than willing to answer questions about their products, which is true. They are one of the better companies in terms of customer support. However, when it comes to real technical information they cannot help their customers. Even with the 128 being discontinued, there is still a large market of owners and 64 owners. The 64 version of Super C is almost identical to the 128 version. Therefore, any suggestions that I make can be equally valid for 64 owners.