Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!wuarchive!usc!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!zardoz.cpd.com!dhw68k!felix!asylvain From: asylvain@felix.UUCP (Alvin "the Chipmunk" Sylvain) Newsgroups: comp.society.futures Subject: Re: Paperless office Summary: more on electronic signatures Keywords: electronic signatures Message-ID: <152585@felix.UUCP> Date: 22 Oct 90 22:55:53 GMT References: <9010031156.AA26927@encore.encore.com> <152165@felix.UUCP> <27791@bellcore.bellcore.com> Sender: daemon@felix.UUCP Reply-To: asylvain@felix.UUCP (Alvin "the Chipmunk" Sylvain) Organization: FileNet Corp., Costa Mesa, CA Lines: 84 In article <27791@bellcore.bellcore.com> duncan@ctt.bellcore.com (Scott Duncan) writes: > In article <152165@felix.UUCP> asylvain@felix.UUCP (Alvin E. Sylvain) writes: > > > > Come on now, do you really > >know *exactly* where your auto registration is? Or will take you some > >time to locate it? Can you find 1988's 1040 filing in under 5 minutes? > > Wel...since you asked: yes and yes. Which only goes to suggest that _some_ > people will dislike paper disappearing but adjust while others won't while > others will like it disappearing and discover what an adjustment it is! Gimme a minute! Unless you're the exception to the rule, and are *very* organized, I'll think up an important piece of paper you've lost (I can find my taxes, but my auto-registration remains a mystery). Seriously, I'm not really worried about people adjusting to it. My father is 84 years old, and has adjusted rather nicely to automobiles, telephones, jet airplanes ... none of which existed in his father's time. (Haven't tried introducing him to computers ... and he won't carry an ATM card! Oh well ...) [...] > (A sidebar to this is that when you deposit a check at the bank, the deposit > slip, as far as I know, is NOT a legal receipt. For cash, yes, but if a bank > flubs your deposit, you have to get copies of the checks you claim you deposit- > ed from everyone who gave them to you. We all keeps records on that, right.) Guess what! Unless things have changed, it ain't legal for cash, either! Someone told me a horror story of when he deposited $1000 cash, and began writing checks against it. Well, they "lost" the cash, and his checks bounced. They eventually "found" the cash, but he still had to pay all kinds of fees for rubber checks. You see, the rubber checks were still "his" responsibility. He changed banks. (Fat lot of good it'll do, the rules are the same all over.) [...] > All interesting stuff from the security perspective. I guess what I've been > trying to point out is that most people (individuals and representatives of > business) don't care about this stuff much until it becomes a "legal issue." > Eliminazting large amounts of paper where there is little or no "legal" impli- > cation seems to me to be well within our technological capacity IF we get the > people who will be involved to become more comfortable with it as a form of > informal communication. (The legal stuff is formal anyway. I am willing to > let it go on via paper if that makes folks happy.) I think my friend's horror story speaks for itself. Certainly, no one cares about it until it becomes "legal". Unfortunately, *everything* you sign is a *legal document* (even your timecard). And, as a legal document, there is potential to bite you when you least expect it. You're not *very* worried about your signature on your credit card until someone steals it. Even then, you're only responsible for the first $50 if you report it in time... but the thief can ransact a mall with $49 purchases before you discover it's missing, and the bank will happily pass the costs on to you indirectly. What I'm hoping for is something that will *improve* paper security, if for no other reason that the technology can potentially allow so many more abuses and at a much larger scale. The C-card thief must *walk or drive* from store to store ... The thief who manages to forge your electronic signature can potentially ransact the *entire electronic planet* before he's detected! Therefore, until there is some progress in the security area, *full* implementation of "paperless-ness" must remain suspect. === Warning: potential subject drift impending === But, lest one think I'm being too nit-pickety, there is still room for "paperless-ness" in areas less prone to security-legal problems using current technology. E.g., information retrieval (such as USENET, Compuserve, etc.) certainly fall into that category. Why not "paperless-ize" the Public Library? Many authors produce their work using word-processors, and quite a few submit the work on floppies. Even for authors who can't bear to throw away their rusty ol' typewriter, many publishers have the work transcribed into computers anyway. So it should be relatively easy for publishers to make both paper and electronic versions available to purchasers, including and especially the PL. Of course, the authors and publishers produce copyrighted work, and they won't want you printing more than one paper copy without payment! *Sigh*, back to security again! -- =============Opinions are Mine, typos belong to /bin/ucb/vi============= "We're sorry, but the reality you have dialed is no | Alvin longer in service. Please check the value of pi, | "the Chipmunk" or pray to your local deity for assistance." | Sylvain =============================================UUCP: hplabs!felix!asylvain