Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!wuarchive!sdd.hp.com!hp-pcd!hpcvlx!will
From: will@hpcvlx.cv.hp.com (David A. Williams)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.hp
Subject: Re: VUE and OpenLook Apps
Message-ID: <101950152@hpcvlx.cv.hp.com>
Date: 22 Oct 90 22:31:58 GMT
References: <38@gauss.mmlai.UUCP>
Organization: Hewlett-Packard Co., Corvallis, OR, USA
Lines: 68

Tony Burzio at Martin Marietta Labs writes:

> ... First, I am concerned about reliability
> of the software (never thought I would say that :-).  We
> have one HP that has the pre-loaded HP-UX with a few X
> programs included.  Normally, the HP-UX you get on tape is
> the most stable UNIX I have used.  The pre-loaded variety,
> however, is the most unstable crash-prone fill-up-your-disk
> system I have seen.  During our sea trials, the system had
> to be rebooted several times a day to cure serious problems.

As the product manager for HP VUE, I am concerned you are
having this experience.  Since I have not heard of buggy
behavior from any other source (it's wonderful having a 
product where all the phone calls are complements) I wonder
if you have an earlier pre-release copy of the software or if
you have a very unusual system configuration.  Can you 
give more information about what you are doing and the kinds
of bugs?  (You may wish to correspond with me directly or for
even faster response, get you HP support organization involved.)
While I am confident HP VUE is not the problem, I will
not excuse HP VUE until we are certain it is innocent.
  
> What a terrible thing to do to the novice user, the intended
> audience for pre-loaded HP-UX.  

Indeed it would be and we went to great lengths to avoid
doing so.  Again, this seems to be a singularity so lets find
the problem.

> ... The defaults configuration
> of X is also very hard, since everything is different from
> normal X....

I disagree that everything is different from "normal X" even though
we did have to add a number of resources to allow the user to
have customization control over the extended features HP VUE
brings to the workstation.

> --Second, the user interface IS the machine, not a tack on.
> One would have thought that Apple would be a good example to
> emulate.  They provide (note to HP management types: with a
> higher price) a user included interface that is fool-proof.
> Last I saw Apple was doing pretty well.  Remember, for new
> customers adding VUE is easier, since you can slip it in to
> the capital equipment price.  Try explaining to your boss
> that you need a couple of more grand here, a couple of more
> grand there for a user interface, when the Sun guy down the
> hall got his user interface for free!
> 
> Oh well, off to twist my boss's arm to scrape up the $5000 for
> UIMX, plus maybe VUE and Softbench and...  I can hear him now,
> "Why not just get a Sun and get a user interface for free, plus
> loads of free software?"  I don't have a good answer for that.

The only people who are paying for HP VUE are the ones who already
have a machine.  In this case, we rightfully get to recoup the
cost of the tape, packaging, shipping, etc.  If someone orders
a new Series 400 with Instant Ignition, HP VUE is free.
And with the advent of HP-UX 8.0, HP VUE will come bundled with
all workstations, Instant Ignition or not.  With this in mind, I
am not certain what it is you are trying to say here.


Dave Williams
Product Manager
Interface Technology Operation
Hewlett-Packard