Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!munnari.oz.au!metro!news
From: carsup@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (Fisher Library support)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.misc
Subject: Re: NuBus/030-Direct cards for IIsi
Summary: Pros and Cons, Myth vs Truth
Message-ID: <1990Oct25.033358.3171@metro.ucc.su.OZ.AU>
Date: 25 Oct 90 03:33:58 GMT
References: <329@ub.d.umn.edu> <90296.165727CXT105@psuvm.psu.edu>
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Reply-To: carsup@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (Fisher Library support)
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In article <90296.165727CXT105@psuvm.psu.edu> CXT105@psuvm.psu.edu (Christopher Tate) writes:
>First, a question:  from what I've seen of the spec sheets, it seems that
>in order to expand your IIsi, you MUST purchase one or the other of these
>adapter cards -- you can't plug anything into the IIsi directly.  Is
>this really true?

	Yes, sort of.  The slot on board is really a PDS to
start with.  That means you are welcome to stick your SE/30 PDS card in as
long as you don't put the lid back on.  Sort of driving your mac like a
convertible with a surf board sticking out! :)

>Now, the complaint:  why has Apple gone and forced its customers to make
>such a decision?  It can't be that difficult to build an adapter that
>would allow *either* a NuBus card or an 030-Direct card, depending on
>(for example) a switch setting on the adapter.  You might need more than
>one card socket, one for each type of card, but how hard is that?
>
	You can jam a 96 pin NuBus card into a 120 pin PDS.  Apple
doesn't want that.  You don't want that.  Macs aren't just for experienced
users like you.  One of the important aspects of macs is their ease in setting
up.  There is a less chance of confusion this way.

>By arranging things this way, Apple forces people who buy IIsi's to
>decide whether they want NuBus or 030-Direct, but not both, as soon
>as they decide they need a coprocessor!  Why can't the coprocessor fit
>into a drop-in socket on the motherboard, for instance?  Why do you
>need a slot adapter just to have a coprocessor?
>
	In order to save cost, less is more.  It costs a lot more to do it your
way.  I think they *should* have done it your way.  It's a matter of $$$.

>IMHO, this is one of the stupider design choices Apple has ever made.
>It cripples the IIsi market by inflicting indecision on customers.  In
>words often quoted, "there's got to be a better way."  But no, IIsi
>owners are forced to decide in advance whether they would rather have
>NuBus or 030-Direct technology.  And if they want both, they have to
>buy TWO coprocessors!!  Stupid, stupid, stupid....
>
	Or buy an si for each :)
	Seriously, NuBus in general costs less than PDS equivalents.  NuBus is
hampered by a max of 10MHz bus speed (correct me if I'm wrong, but the point
here is in the comparison) whereas PDS can be 20MHz.  If you want speed, get
the PDS.  If you want variety and savings, get NuBus.  How hard could it get?
Don't forget, you can only have one card!  Otherwise, get a IIci.

	Also, when you stop and think what Apple is really trying to do, it
probably makes sense.  Ponder this:  what is the *real* market that the IIsi
is targeted at?  I don't really think it's our market.  The people who gets
to read this probably belongs to some non-commercial institutions.  In bringing
out three low cost machines, the Classic is for the masses, labs, home use etc.
The LC is clearly targeted at the schools/unis and labs.  But the IIsi I think
is aimed squarely at the business market.

	Consider this: Not all PCs come with an FPU standard.  Not all
businesses need FPUs.  In offering as an option, cost savings.  The si has a 
lot of built-in features.  Built-in video support for the 2 12" monitors, the
13" and *especially* the A4 portrait is an important marketing exercise.  There
is AppleTalk of course, what do you think the businesses would need in an 
expansion card?  I believe si's will probably cover about 70% at least of what
businesses need in a machine.  For the others, there is still the ci and fx...

	So, before we all get worked up over Apple's quirks, is the si meant to
be for us in the first place?  If you were the buying officer in a business,
would it not be better to have an si with these sort of specs?  The si will 
probably be faster without an FPU than a Compaq 386/25e and IBM Model 70 386
(25 MHz).  The si/'882 will beat even the IBM Model 70 486 (25 MHz) provided
the PCs are running Windows 3.0 and running applications such as Wingz,
PowerPoint, Excel, Word, PageMaker, Omnis etc.  (Mail me for more info)

	In conclusion, try to understand Apple before accusing them.  I am a
harsh critic of Apple myself, and I also agree with you had the machine been
targeted at the academic market.  It would just about be impossible to have
a 24 bit colour system on Ethernet (not using the SCSI for comms) with an si.
I want more slots too, alas it is not to be.  I just hope the IIsi will be a
success in the market I think it is targeted at so Apple may be able to provide
us with what *we* want in the not too distant future.

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