Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!zephyr.ens.tek.com!uw-beaver!milton!dali.cs.montana.edu!rpi!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!umich!umeecs!msi.umn.edu!cs.umn.edu!kksys!orbit!pnet51!granteri From: granteri@pnet51.orb.mn.org (Grant Erickson) Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.misc Subject: Re: NuBus/030-Direct cards for IIsi Message-ID: <3376@orbit.cts.com> Date: 26 Oct 90 04:47:41 GMT Sender: news@orbit.cts.com Organization: People-Net [pnet51], Minneapolis, MN. Lines: 84 CXT105@psuvm.psu.edu (Christopher Tate) writes: >In article <0093EAB1.E1F7F0A0@KING.ENG.UMD.EDU>, sysmgr@KING.ENG.UMD.EDU (Doug >Mohney) says: >> >>> [I ask why the IIsi coprocessor doesn't go on the motherboard] >> >>Lowers the cost of motherboard production and saves real estate. Apple made a >>big thing about "Apple Engineering" and shrinking size (as compared to >>three-letter-companies). If you are doing dPub, word processing, or graphics, >>having a math coprocessor won't break you, or the speed of the machine. > >Okay, I'll accept this. However, I contest the claim that "doing graphics" >isn't computationally intensive. You really should have a coprocessor if >you're doing heavily graphics intensive work; the speed difference is >noticable. > >>> [I say that the necessity of deciding in advance whether one wants to >>> use NuBus instead of PDS is a bad thing, as is the necessity of >>> paying for two coprocessors if you want to be able to use both PDS >>> and NuBus] >> >>Babbling youngster, having meditated over this question, I think it isn't a >>BAD idea. With the SE & SE/30, you got PDS. Period. With the II >ci,cx,fx> you get (as I under stand) Only NuBus. You have a choice. >> >>The "si market" is anyone who wants a low-cost '030 machine with a color >>monitor. If you need a slot, I'm willing to bet that 4 out of 5 people will >>go get the NuBus gizmo, leaving 1 out of 5 to play with the processor-direct >>slot...that's not a bad idea. >> >>It might have been NICER to put both PDS and Nubus on the board, but then >>people would have been bitching about the cost of the si... > >(At this point, I will completely ignore the subject of whether or not the > entire Macintosh line should, in fact, be less expensive.) > >This still doesn't explain why I have to buy the coprocessor twice if I >want to use both NuBus and PDS. Why can't I just transfer the 68882 from >the one adapter to the other (by putting it on a mini-card, or some such)? > >Apple has assumed that people are going to want to use one expansion >method or the other, but not both. I'm wondering whether this will really >be the case. If Macintoshes in general were significantly cheaper, then >I'd believe it; people who now are locked into buying Classics (or formerly >Plus's) for budget reasons could buy IIsi's instead, and be happier about >getting a machine with SOME expansion capability.... However, many people >have wanted to upgrade/expand their SE's, or their Plus's, which I take as >evidence that the similar group of new Macintosh owners who get IIsi's will >also want to upgrade. > >The adapter/coprocessor cards for the IIsi cost about $180 (academic). >How much of that is the cost of the coprocessor? Would it really be >prohibitively expensive to change the design of the adapter cards to >allow coprocessors to be moved from one to another? PDS and NuBus each >have their own advantages and disadvantages (NuBus is slow, but there >are lots of different products available; PDS is fast, but there are >currently few products available). If the coprocessor is a significant >portion of the cost of the adapter cards (as implied by the fact that, >contrary to Apple's past claims to the contrary, the new Macs do not >come with the coprocessor standard), it would be a boon to those people >on tight budgets (at whom the machine is supposedly targeted) to be able >to buy their second adapter card without the additional cost of the >duplicate coprocessor.... or, they could buy just one adapter, without >the coprocessor, if they don't need the math boost, thereby avoiding >paying money for a feature they didn't ask for. > >I guess I just resent not being able to pay for ONLY what I want to have, >instead of being forced to pay for just those arrangements that Apple has >deigned to offer us.... I'd just like to add the comment that, "There are always 3rd party vendors." Grant Erickson .______________________________________________________. | UUCP: {crash, tcnet}!orbit!pnet51!granteri | | ARPA: crash!orbit!pnet51!granteri@nosc.mil | | INET: granteri@pnet51.orb.mn.org | |------------------------------------------------------| | The right half of the brain controls the left half | | of the body. This means that only left-handed people | | are in their right mind. | !______________________________________________________!