Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!newstop!jaytee!bodleian!geoff From: geoff@bodleian.East.Sun.COM (Geoff Arnold @ Sun BOS - R.H. coast near the top) Newsgroups: comp.protocols.nfs Subject: Re: Enduring PC-NFS Annoyances Message-ID: <3160@jaytee.East.Sun.COM> Date: 1 Nov 90 19:00:14 GMT References: <10083@uhccux.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu> <1990Oct31.213006.12428@naitc.naitc.com> <1430@travis.csd.harris.com> Sender: news@East.Sun.COM Reply-To: geoff@east.sun.com (Geoff Arnold @ Sun BOS - R.H. coast near the top) Organization: Sun Microsystems PC-NFS Engineering Lines: 110 Quoth leoh@hardy.hdw.csd.harris.com (Leo Hinds) (in <1430@travis.csd.harris.com>): #In article <1990Oct31.213006.12428@naitc.naitc.com> karl@bbs.naitc.com (Karl Denninger) writes: # #>1) It isn't serialized. This isn't a license to cheat; rather, it's #> a way to keep control reasonable (do YOU want a filing cabinet full #> of 300 licenses and disks for same?!) # #SUN ... are you listening :-) ... if _you insist_ on serializing, then let me #suggest an alternative ... generic installation on all systems with a serial #number disk that is unique to that location. This would allow us to #arc/zoo/zip a standard installation, and still let it have its own serial #number. I'm listening, I'm listening :-) Most of our large customers buy right-to-copy (RTC) kits, in which we sell them a set of diskettes and a serialization kit. They are free to use this to manufacture multiple full kits, or (more commonly) to create a serialized PCNFS.SYS for each system. The downside: documentation must be purchased separately. Here's the dilemma we face on distribution. The obvious, neat, whizzy solution is to ship a PC-NFS server kit on a SPARCstation CD-ROM, let users produce unserialized setup diskettes using their SPARCstation floppy drives (or ship 'em with the kit), and do over-the wire setup. You need only keep a few files on the PC; everything else can come off the server. OK, if you really want you can download the whole kit'n'caboodle to the PC hard disk. Your choice. That's fine for Sun servers (and Solbourne, and Toshiba, and Tatung, and Mars, and ... that's what ABI's are for, right?). The problem is, how do I do all of that for non-Sun systems? Do I need a DECstation server kit, and a MIPS kit, and an RS/6000 kit....? Do I have to continue to offer both kinds of product packaging - self-contained kits for PCs as well as server kits? As in any large company, we are always under pressure to reduce the complexity of our pricing and minimise the number of line items in the pricing book. Plus I need in-house systems to put any of this stuff through SQA. Anyone want to donate a DECstation? (Just kidding.) How about bootstrap protocols? "bootp" you all cry. Fine, except that Sun uses the RPC-based "bootparams" for diskless workstations, and as far as I know will continue to do so. We can expect any developments in system management capabilities on Suns to reflect this. Should the PC-NFS group strike off independently, requiring that we support bootp on all Suns which serve PC-NFS clients? Saying that Sun should use bootp instead of bootparams is not a constructive response... #>2) It works with packet drivers out of the box. # #I'm currently running pc-nfs with packet drivers. I have no problem with people using the packet driver stuff I've passed around. However Sun won't touch copylefted packet drivers with the proverbial pole, and our SQA cannot certify PC-NFS with packet drivers as a "supported configuration". Whether or not I can include unsupported software on our standard product media is a thorny question that I've been reluctant to pose to the people who draft our licenses. # #>4) It's solid, knows how to do printer redirection, and WORKS WITH #> WINDOWS 3, including printer support. NO PHANTOM DRIVES and NO #> crashes! # #What's the status of the SUN talks with Microsoft on this? ... Ongoing. Looking pretty good, actually. The bottom line is that it's very hard for me to tell you all that you want to know. Sun policy is very firm on this: I cannot discuss the contents and release dates of unannounced products. I can tell you some of what we're thinking about long-term, with no dates, commitments, or specifics. I'm not sure which is more frustrating: a user saying "X is broken: is Sun going to fix it and if so when?" or me sitting here reading it, knowing that the fix is completed and integrated into the code for the next release, and knowing when that release is planned for, and not being able to tell you. When that happens, the only solution is to "play stresspill.au" (which I won't append, since it's 156K; it's that nice quote from 2001 where HAL urges Dave to sit down and take a stress pill). I promise you that I read every item posted to this group. I actually have archives of all of it, which I should probably transfer to one more more anonFTP sites at some point - the total is around 2.7MB. (JBVB - do you want to archive it at FTP.COM?) A few of you email questions directly to me. Some of these I answer, some I pass on to our support staff, and some (I admit) I don't get around to replying to. If you can post questions here, you're more likely to get a response - if not from me, then from another PC-NFS user, or from FTP, Wollongong, B&W, etc.!!! Please remember, however, that comp.protocols.nfs is no substitute for the Sun customer support service. A useful adjunct, of course, but not a substitute. If I pass on an email or posting about a bug to our support staff, they are likely to contact you to ask for the Service Order number you received when you called in to 1-800-USA-4SUN. If you didn't call the bug in through the "correct" channels, it only wastes people's time. [Yes, I know that some years ago the quality of Sun's support was such that people felt justified in bypassing it where possible. These days, it works, and you should use it wherever possible.] (If all else fails, hang out on the middle section of Route 128 and flag down any car with Mass. license "PC.NFS"....) -- Geoff Arnold, PC-NFS architect, Sun Microsystems. (geoff@East.Sun.COM) -- *** "Now is no time to speculate or hypothecate, but rather a time *** *** for action, or at least not a time to rule it out, though not *** *** necessarily a time to rule it in, either." - George Bush ***