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From: thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga
Subject: Re: Frustrating problem with ftp
Message-ID: <35333@cup.portal.com>
Date: 27 Oct 90 22:23:24 GMT
References: <15583.2729f9c6@levels.sait.edu.au>
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Lines: 66

gsrfy@levels.sait.edu.au in <15583.2729f9c6@levels.sait.edu.au> writes:

	Error 121 on trying to load a binary file
	[...]

	... to "ftp" AMIGA software from "ux1.cso.uiuc.edu". This time I had
	my trusty old AMIGA 500 hooked up to the VAX where I work.

	I used the Shareware programme "handshake" to download software using
	KERMIT protocol. I made certain that I selected 8-bit binary mode on
	"handshake" and I issued a command "SET FILE TYPE BINARY" to the kermit
	server programme on the VAX.

	Result : although I had no problems when I downloaded text files, when
	I downloaded "AMIGAZOO" from the ftp-site and then tried to run the
	resulting binary image, the system on my AMIGA told me "ERROR 121".

	( Yes, I made a special point of issuing the "BINARY" command while
	accessing the ftp-site. )

You haven't supplied enough info to permit someone to help you.  For example:

On your VAX, are you running VMS or some UNIX variant?   Is the "VAX" Kermit
the "C-Kermit", "Kermit-32", or the earlier Pascal variant?

Whose FTP was used (Woolongong or some other)?

Did you specify byte swapping or "network byte order" for the ftp?  Remember,
the VAX stores bytes in little-endian order, contrary to everything else
except Intel 80?86.  This means, for example, your name would be stored on a
VAX as "nauY kciR" (instead of "Rick Yuan") and that binary numbers such as
0x12345678 would be stored in a VAX as 0x56781234; can you guess what that
does to binary archives such as ZOO or tar.Z when you access the bytes in a
sequential manner?  :-)

If you are running VMS on your VAX, did you do "ANALYZE/RMS <filename>" to
see if it was some "funny" VMS/RMS format after the ftp?   What you want to
see is "binary stream <LF>" (or some such) file type for highest portability.

A VAX-with-VMS system is probably the most troublesome combination interfacing
to other computers (with the possible exception of some IBM mainframes).

Though I have zmodem working between one of my VAX/VMS systems and an Amiga,
I wouldn't even think of transferring binary data because it's a hair-pulling
experience.  Among the problems include the facts that VMS has no concept of
a file's size (i.e. the number of bytes) and that, on VMS, a file is not a file
is not a file as is common on other systems ... there are eleventy-seven
thousand combinations of "file types" (NOT extensions, actual different storage
methods, byte retrieval, etc.) which are the cause of no end of problems with
inter-system file compatibility.

I successfully transfer text data using C-Kermit on the VAX/VMS; haven't
tried binary.  You may wish to get C-Kermit from an archive site and compile
it on your VAX and see if its "binary" mode is less troublesome.

Next year some of these problems may be "history." Ken Olson (Pres of DEC)
stated publicly this past week (in response to DEC's 2-year earnings decline
and anticipated layoff of some 16,000-20,000 people) that VAX/VMS is (for all
intents) doomed (HOORAY!) and that in 1991 DEC will provide a merged UNIX
product to replace VMS (I take this to mean that he also acknowledges Ultrix
is out of the picture (hope, hope)).

The GNU people at FSF (Free Software Foundation) have been calling "VMS"
the "Vomit Making System" for many good reasons.  :-)

Thad Floryan [ thad@cup.portal.com (OR) ..!sun!portal!cup.portal.com!thad ]