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From: SECBH%CUNYVM.BITNET@oac.ucla.edu
Newsgroups: sci.med.aids
Subject: Denial/Acceptance
Message-ID: <40719@shemp.CS.UCLA.EDU>
Date: 29 Oct 90 15:28:19 GMT
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>rob@mtdiablo.Concord.CA.US (Rob Boldbear) quotes and comments
>In article Re: JOHN testing +, and friends concern:

>>In article <40699@shemp.CS.UCLA.EDU> Michael T Mucci) writes:
>> (material on Kubler Ross's stages of denial/acceptance deleted)
>>
>>DENIAL
>>ANGER
>>DEPRESSION
>>BARGAINING-OH PLEASE GOD.MAKE ME BETTER,, I
>>    SWEAR ILL GO TO CHURCH EVERYDAY
>>ACCEPTANCE

>I thought long ago this was shown to be wrong.
>These aren't stages at all.
>Sure when people experience a "loss", they go through periods when they
>feel one or more of these five, but they aren't stages:
>	- they often don't occur in sequence
>	- a person might return to one of those feelings multiple times
>	- a person might not experience all give
>	- a person might experience more than one at a time
> (and some other good observations deleted)

I feel that Rob's comments are very important, both to those who are
battling a serious illness and to those who are trying to help them.

I admire the work of Kubler Ross, but it is unfortunate that in
desperation many people have seen her stages as an immutable process
which the ill _should_ replicate and a lot of well-intended mischief
has come of that view.

I have had chronic hepatitis B and C since 1979.  My experience
has been that anger, denial, depression and acceptance have (and
are) parts of my "pattern" at various times, but that bargaining
has not been a significant element.  Where I am in the "stages"
is very contingent upon my current level of well-being and has
very little to do with overall progression of my illness.

I began helping friends with AIDS in the early 80s and have been
a volunteer Care Management Partner for PWAs since the mid-80s.
The relationships I have formed with these people have often been much
easier for me than other volunteers.  I think this is mostly a result
of my awareness of my own experience with a prolonged disabling illness.
I have found, as have many persons with AIDS whom I have known, that
over time the bouncing back and forth amongst these "stages" can be
a bigger pain in the ass than the physical problems.

The "pattern" of these "stages" seems to be radial rather serial.
The problem becomes, then, dealing with constant emotional shifts
more than with stages toned by a single emotion.

I have found, as have some PWAs I have known, that Steven Levine's
approach covers the same territory but in a more realistic way.

Jack Carroll