Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rutgers!usc!wuarchive!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!ncar!ico!rcd From: rcd@ico.isc.com (Dick Dunn) Newsgroups: comp.arch Subject: Re: OS cost component of workstation Summary: X is not UNIX Message-ID: <1990Nov6.222057.17797@ico.isc.com> Date: 6 Nov 90 22:20:57 GMT References: <2840@crdos1.crd.ge.COM> Organization: Interactive Systems Corporation, Boulder, CO Lines: 51 davidsen@crdos1.crd.ge.COM (Wm E Davidsen Jr) writes: > If by "cheap" you mean "low part of the price range," as in "cheap > car," at the moment you just can't buy a decent unix machine which fits > the "cheap 386" class... I think you can; in fact, I have. But that's because I have exactly one different assumption from Davidsen... > I've evaluated about 15 machines (with the help of friends), > and concluded that to run a useful unix environment (as opposed to a > toy), you want 8MB RAM and 200MB disk. Otherwise you give up compilers, > or X, or news, or whatever, and you certainly give up performance. The problem is X. You can have a good, *real* UNIX machine for well under $2000 for hardware as long as you don't want X. A 386SX has enough power, 4 Mb is plenty of memory, and an 80-100 Mb disk will do. Now add X, and some layers above to let you do something with it (like OpenLook or Motif, and a window manager). Oh, sure, it's neat; you've got bas-relief window borders (that you actually use at least once every few thousand keystrokes:-) and pleasant colors and cute little icons. And it increases the cost of the machine by more than 50%. It's a bit like going out to buy a car, costing $8000 for the basic vehicle plus $5000 for a trim-and-instrumentation package. Figure it out: You need a monitor capable of 1024x768, probably color. If your brain operates at anything close to normal frequency (some suits can apparently tolerate a 56 Hz monitor, but few other folks can), you need a pretty good display card. That's about $700 over the cost of a good char- acter display and card. Davidsen's right about memory--add 4 Mb @ $50-55. Add a mouse (we'll waste a precious serial port) for $75 for a decent one. Oh, and you'll need a bunch more disk. Better add at least 20 Mb; incre- mental cost is $3.50-4.00/Mb. You've added over $1000 to the hardware cost of a machine that was under $2000. It ain't the fault of the hardware folks...and it ain't the fault of UNIX. The hardware exists right now (in fact, has existed for some time) to make a cheap, good UNIX system. It's just that we allow software bloat to move so fast it gives us zero or negative net technical progress (*if* we buy into it). See the discussion in comp.misc, Subject: A tirade about in- efficient software & systems. Duly noted, Davidsen's (valid) statements about how big emacs is. But I see that the X server here on my machine is also larger than the (absurdly large) kernel. -- Dick Dunn rcd@ico.isc.com -or- ico!rcd Boulder, CO (303)449-2870 ...but Meatball doesn't work that way!