Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rutgers!usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.ircc.ohio-state.edu!news From: smsmith@hpuxa.ircc.ohio-state.edu (Stephen M. Smith) Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.games Subject: Re: Programmer seeking game ideas Message-ID: <1990Nov3.212628.22893@magnus.ircc.ohio-state.edu> Date: 3 Nov 90 21:26:28 GMT References: <10959.272d8b3f@amherst.bitnet> <1025@lclark.UUCP> Sender: news@magnus.ircc.ohio-state.edu Organization: The Ohio State University (IRCC) Lines: 108 Nntp-Posting-Host: hpuxa.ircc.ohio-state.edu In article <1025@lclark.UUCP> hulsej@lclark.UUCP (Jose Hulse) writes: >I am also an arcade game fan, but what I'd really like to see someday is a >fantasy role-playing game, of the Might&Magic or Wizardry variety, with a >multiplayer or head-to head option. That way, it would be a competition to >see which player's party could solve the game first. Naturally, for some >real fun, you'd be able to pit your party against another player's party in >a no-holds barred fight, complete with fireballs, disintegration spells, etc., >with the program moderating the battle. Now *that* would be fun!.... This is a fascinating subject to me, and I've been wondering for some time whether anybody would try it. The difficulty in creating such a game would be to try to figure out how to run the thing on one computer instead of on MVS or instead of on two computers connected by modems. There are other problems here too. There has been some good discussion in the newsgroup rec.games.frp lately which concerns the knowledge which the various characters have versus the knowledge which the human players have. If one group learns something, how could the other party not learn about it as well even though they shouldn't since they might be elsewhere? In other words, each adventuring group would have to be taken out by a *different* player, and that player would not be able to give any hints to the other players in the game. But this would mean that the game could only be played in a sequential, chronological mode--i.e., no two parties could be adventuring at the same *time*; otherwise they might run into each other or if the game was badly designed then they could be performing the same actions in the same place (such as talking to Mr. X) and not even know the other party was there! Also, there should be designed into the game the ability for one group's actions in an area to affect what the other group(s) would find and experience in that area should they go there at some later time. I don't see how this can be done very well unless you have two keyboards and two monitors (or more) so that the time that passes in the game is the same for all the characters in the game. If you tried to play just one group at a time and wanted the possibility of running into another group, how else would you do it? I suppose if you had enough room on your hard disk that the game could be automatically saved every time the party took a single step so that if another group ventured on a square which had been occupied at that same time by the previous group they would then encounter one another. But this would mean that all the actions of the first group would be become nullified for all the time they have spent after they left that square. And it would mean that your players (human players) would end up knowing more than your game characters since they would have found out things that the party had once found out, but now should not know about. See what I mean? I'm glad you mentioned Might and Magic. This is my favorite RPG so far. Take a look at how MM (Might and Magic) does this... In MM you take out different groups of people at different times. Although you may have 30 to 40 adventurers you can only adventure with 8 at a time. What do the other 22 to 32 adventurers do when those 8 are out roaming around? Apparently they just sit at the Inn twiddling their thumbs while the party which is out adventuring is getting the *&$#@ beat out of them. Another possible way of doing this is to have geographically restricted areas. One group could be taken into a certain area, and then if you wanted to take another group out you could choose the time to start out (from the time the first group left till the present), and then take them into another area which did not at any geographical point overlap that of the first one. This way you could have a number of parties out and simply toggle between them via different windows. Of course this would mean 1) You would be playing them at different *game* times, so that for one group it might be nighttime and for another group it could be midday, and 2) What happens to one group could *not* have any direct bearings upon another group--especially if the knowledge that one group obtains would be beneficial for another group. This might be on various levels... Let's say that one group encounters a certain creature, fights it, finds its vulnerable points, and kills it. The creatures in MM are very much this way--some can only be hit physically and some can only be affected by magic, etc. Then what happens if another group (adventuring in another place and having had no contact with the first group) should come upon this same monster? *YOU* know how to fight this monster, but *THEY* shouldn't. See the inherent problems here? ...or on another level, if you want this game to be played by one person who is using several parties, then (as stated above) those parties would have to be solving absolutely independent problems/goals. Otherwise if one group obtains clues that could be beneficial to another group *YOU* would know about it, but wouldn't it be cheating to alter the actions of the other group since *THEY* shouldn't know about it? You might say "Well, I'll build telepathic abilities into my characters so they can share useful information over long distances." Bzzzzzzt.... This would mean that ALL the groups would have to be adventuring (or lounging around at an "Inn") at the *same* game time. This doesn't even scratch the surface of all the difficulties. What about time travel--an element that many RPG's use, such as Ultima and MM? What a mess to even start trying to figure that out! I'm sure there is a way of doing this. A discussion of this should be moved to rec.games.int-fiction. I will be quoting your posting and about 4 others from rec.games.frp in rec.games.int-fiction soon to start a discussion on this there. S. "Stevie" Smith \ + / ,,@ ircc.ohio-state. \ + / {7%*@,..":27g)-=,#*:.#,/6&1*.4-,l@#9:-) " edu> \ + / BTW, WYSInaWYG \ + / --witty.saying.ARC 4 other postings from