Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!bcm!dimacs.rutgers.edu!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: wagner@karazm.math.uh.edu (David Wagner) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: Infant Baptism (Was Re: Validity of Baptism) Message-ID: Date: 8 Nov 90 03:34:13 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: University of Houston -- Department of Mathematics Lines: 95 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article charles@rpi.edu (Charles K. Hurst) writes: >David, your quote says "All who believe...". Do infants believe? How >do you know this? > >Charles K. Hurst >charles@pawl.rpi.edu >**One who is interested in learning** This is a fair question, a good followup to my somewhat sketchy article. Luther and Melancthon, who pretty much took infant Baptism for granted, (only the 'Anabaptists' rejected infant baptism in Luther's day, and Lutherans and Catholics were united in condemning the errors of the Anabaptists, and concentrated their efforts on other issues) reasoned thus: "That the Baptism of infants is pleasing to Christ is sufficiently proved from his own work. God has sanctified many who have been thus baptized and has given them his Holy Spirit. Even today there are not a few whose doctrine and life attest that they have the Holy Spirit. Similarly by God's grace we have been given the power to interpret the Scriptures and to know Christ, which is impossible without the Holy Spirit. Now, if God did not accept the Baptism of infants, he would not have given any of them the Holy Spirit nor any part of him; in short, all this time down to the present day no man on earth could have been a Christian. Since God has confirmed Baptism through the gift of his Holy Spirit, as we have perceived in some of the fathers, such as St. Bernard [I think this refers to Bernard of Clairvaux, a monk of the 12th century well regarded by Luther], Gerson, John Hus, and others, [later addition: who were baptized in infancy] and since the holy Christian church will abide until the end of the world, our adversaries must acknowledge that infant Baptism is pleasing to God. For he can never be in conflict with himself, support lies and wickedness, or give his grace and Spirit for such ends." (Luthers Large Catechism, see also Melancthon's 'Apology to the Augsburg Confession') Luther next writes: "Further, we are not primarily concerned whether the baptized person believes or not, for in the latter case Baptism does not become invalid. Everything depends upon the Word and commandment of God. This, perhaps, is a rather subtle point, but it is based upon what I have already said, that Baptism is simply water and God's Word in and with each other; that is, when the Word accompanies the water, Baptism is valid, even though faith be lacking. For my faith does not constitute Baptism but receives it. Baptism does not become invalid even if it is wrongly received or used, for it is bound not to our faith but to the Word." Now, to try to answer your question more directly, in Matthew 28:18-20 (The Great Commision) Jesus mentions baptism, together with teaching, as a means of making disciples. It is interesting to note that he mentions baptism before teaching. I see this as indicating, perhaps not conclusively, that Baptism is a means for the Holy Spirit to work faith in peoples hearts, apart from teaching. Naturally this faith needs to be fed and strengthened through teaching: "Like newborn babies, crave pure spiritual milk, so that by it you may grow up in your salvation, now that you have tasted that the Lord is good." (1 Peter 2:2,3) Even if you do not agree with this, you must agree that we cannot teach infants. Yet God still desires that they be brought into his kingdom. For Jesus said: "Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these." (Matthew 19:14, also Mark and Luke). Since we are commanded to make disciples of them, and we cannot teach, we baptize, for we are commanded to do this generally, on the one hand, and are not forbidden from baptizing infants. (Can I say this in Texas and yet live? :-) ) I hope you find this helpful. David H. Wagner a confessional Lutheran "Dearest Jesus, we are here, gladly Thy command obeying; With this child we now draw near In accord with Thine own saying That to Thee it shall be given As a child and heir of heaven. "Yea Thy word is clear and plain, And we would obey it duly: 'He who is not born again, Heart and life renewing truly, Born of water and the Spirit, Can My kingdom not inherit.' "Therefore hasten we to Thee, In our arms this infant bearing; Let us here Thy glory see, Let this child, Thy mercy sharing In Thine arms be shielded ever, Thine on earth and Thine forever." --'Liebster Jesu, wir sind hier --Benjamin Schmolk, 1704, selected verses. My opinions and beliefs on this matter are disclaimed by The University of Houston.