Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!cbmvax!unland From: unland@cbmvax.commodore.com (Rick Unland - Special Projects) Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga Subject: Re: "IMAGINE" .. a rip off? Message-ID: <15843@cbmvax.commodore.com> Date: 13 Nov 90 23:46:31 GMT References: <730016@hpmwngf.HP.COM> Reply-To: unland@cbmvax.commodore.com (Rick Unland - Special Projects) Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA Lines: 130 In article <730016@hpmwngf.HP.COM> mikep@hpmwtd.HP.COM (Mike Powell) writes: $ $ $ $ I called Impulse regarding Imagine and update policies from Turbo $ Silver. $ $ I'm a bit pissed off. $ $ They informed me that the upgrade period is almost over (the middle $ or end of November). They also informed me that the upgrade cost $ was $150. I paid LESS for Turbo Silver! THEN I'm told that Imagine $ 1.0 is not ready, and that actually I'd be getting a .9xx version! $ I really do not see your problem with this type of upgrade policy. They are using the best possible method to be fair to people that have purchased their previous product. As to what you paid for Turbo Silver what does that have to do with it? Imagine is a totally different program that just happens to have similarities to an existing product. I can assure you (Being one of Turbo Silvers harshest critics) That Imagine is absolutly not the same product. I agree that it is a pain to have to wait for the final version but at least they are letting you get familiar with the different editors and the capabilitie that exist now. They have said that they will ship free of charge the final version to anyone who buys the upgrade. What could be more fair. $ I simply can't imagine (no pun intended) PAYING $150 to be a gamma- $ tester! (in fairness, 1.0 will eventually come as a free upgrade). $ You are not paying for being a Gamma tester, You are paying for a pre-release upgrade path that has certain advantages to waiting for the release product. It is your choice if thoses advantages are enough to convince you to purchase now. $ "May I return the software if I'm not satified?" "No." $ "Would you consider extending the 'upgrade' period past the release $ date of 1.0 so that I might have a chance to evaluate it first?" I do not know of to many third parties that give money back policies if you do not like thier product. Some dealers do this but not developers. Also there are quite a few dealers that have the program and are more than willing to allow you to play with it at their stores. This should allow you to evaluate the program to determine if it is right for you. $ $ "No. Don't you have faith in us?" $ $ I can't believe the guy said that! What kind of business are they $ running? I thought they were selling a software package, not a $ religion! $ I can a do belive he said that. I know the people at Impulse and I know their mindsets also. They believe they are doing the best they can to bring a product to market that is fairly priced and well done. They are also trying to show people that have shown loyalty to thier company some favoritism by allowing them to have the program before others and to give them some advance in using the new features. Sounds like my kind of company. $ I understand that .9xx doesn't have cast shadows, does not have $ a sphere primitive, has WORSE requesters than Turbo Silver (It took $ Silver users years to get impulse to make the improvements that $ went into Turbo Silver... will we have to do this again!?!) This is where I really take offense! You say you understand it has these problems but you dont know. But here you are getting all fired up and publicly decrying faults and problems that you have no first hand knowledge of. You feel that it is ok to malign this product and the company that manufacturs it without knowing what you are talking about. I understand though! If rumers are said often enough they become fact. $ $ Could a owner of Imagine .9xx please take a few moments to present $ their views about the program? (strong and weak points), especially $ in direct comparison to Turbo Silver. Many thanks in advance. $ $ -Mike Powell- This is the correct way your post should have gone. Then after reading all the responses and investigating the product you could have publicly stated from your own knowledge what you think they did wrong. As an owner of Turbo Silver and Imagine and Opticks and Sculpt 4D and Design 3D and Forms in Flight 1 and 2, and many others both commercial and PD. I have to tha Imagine is so far the best 3D program available for an Amiga. I have not seen Light Speed so I cannot comment on it ontehr than to say the animations I shown by NewTek at shows are incredible. Imagine The editors are well thought out and implemented wonderfly. The forms editor is fantastic for creating anmorphic shapes but requires practice. There is a concept to be grasped before you can use the forms editor in production. The Detail Editor is great and allows for the full manipulation of objects and points. Easy to use and understand with quick redraws and fast camera view wireframes. Between the forms editor and the Detail editor there is not much than cant be modeled. All the requesters are just fine and give you all the ability you require inside of a requester. If you are refering to the attributes and transformation requesters then you will see they are very improved from the Turbo Silver ones even though they look similar. The action editor available from the Stage editor is one of the hottest animation tools available in 3D, Similar to Symbolics S Dynamics in its ease of use and the way you can tell exactly whats going on at a glance. The way you can control objects , lights and anything else over time is extremly functional and intuitive. As I have the flu now, I am going to hold on that note but I will be more than happy to discuss this over email. BTW I have an object with over 70,000 polygons that imagine is the only program capable of loading and rendering it. No other 3D program can even load it with the possible exception being Lightwave which I have not seen nor do I have. So next time get your facts straight and learn to be a little more understandin of people that have five to ten man years invested in software that they are selling at such extremely low prices. This program has features that would give high end packages a run for their money. Rick Unland Send flames to >NIL: I wont read them anyway.