Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!lll-winken!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!cunixf.cc.columbia.edu!cunixb.cc.columbia.edu!wln From: wln@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (William L Nussbaum) Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.misc Subject: Re: Not another NeXT defector???!!! Message-ID: <1990Nov20.205507.30067@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> Date: 20 Nov 90 20:55:07 GMT References: <2927@bridge2.ESD.3Com.COM> <1990Nov10.020441.5331@agate.berkeley.edu> <2942@bridge2.ESD.3Com.COM> Sender: news@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (The Daily News) Organization: Columbia University Lines: 73 In article <2942@bridge2.ESD.3Com.COM> ngg@bridge2.ESD.3Com.COM (Norman Goodger) writes: >In article <1990Nov10.020441.5331@agate.berkeley.edu> knrgroup@garnet.berkeley.edu (Raymond group) writes: >>Here we go again. We're back to misconception #1 about the NeXT: the NeXT >>is a typical Unix box. Nothing could be further from the truth. It is not >>like the Sun or any other Unix box, because the NeXT HIDES Unix from the >>user. >> > You still don't get it, probably never will.. So what if Next hides > the unix os from the user. If you own the system and no matter > what interface you slap on it, the user is going to need how to > use the underlying OS somewhere along the line. The GUI interfaces NeXT supplies carry out at least the quantity of operations that Finder/MultiFinder/Etc. provide, WITHOUT having to deal directly with Unix on the textual level. If you want to do a group file operation on a Mac that's beyond the scope of Finder, what do you do? (if it's within the scope of Finder:) .. 0) Use the included Finder operations to do it. (if it's not, as the question presumes:) .. 1) Buy a program that's been written to do it. (if you're a programmer:) .. 2) Write a program of your own to do it. (if not of that works, then:) .. 3) Give up and operate file by file. (if, for some reason, that's not possible either:) .. 4) You give up. All these options still exist on a NeXT, and the NeXT provides as much at the 0 level as the Mac. 1) is going to take some time. If you don't want to mess with Unix, you may still choose any of the other modes of operation. Yes, you may end up learning Unix, but in most cases, it would be to perform an operation that wasn't even an option beforehand. > >>The point I've made over and over again is that the NeXT allows you to >>TOTALLY ignore Unix if you want to. Sit a Unix expert in front of a NeXT >>and he/she would be hard pressed to figure out Unix was running under >>NeXTStep. >> >>Think of it this way. Do you have to know low level Mac OS to use a Mac? >>Absolutely no. Unix on a NeXT is like the Mac OS on a Mac. It is in the >>background and away from the sight of the user. The nice thing about the >>NeXT though is that, if you WANT to, you can access Unix through a nice >>shell and use it. >> >>A NeXT owner will NOT "need" to know Unix. However, perhaps because people >>have the misconception that the NeXT is like a Sun or some other Unix >>workstation, they may not give the NeXT a fair shake. > > This is totally bogus... If the machines underlying OS is Unix, > it is virutally impossible to shield a user from having to have > some knowledge of how it works if they own the machine. Somewhere > along the line they will have to understand and comprehend Unix > to make full use of the system should they own one. If you want > to just sit in front of it and admire the interface all day, thats > fine, but eventually you might want to get some work done, and > depending the users specific needs, that will more than likely > require at some point a comprehension of unix, "Because its there" > and thats what the Next uses to "run" Only if your work is too complex for a Mac or a PC to handle in the first place... >-- >Norm Goodger SysOp - MacInfo BBS @415-795-8862 >3Com Corp. Co-SysOp FreeSoft RT - GEnie. >Enterprise Systems Division (I disclaim anything and everything) >UUCP: {3comvax,auspex,sun}!bridge2!ngg Internet: ngg@bridge2.ESD.3Com.COM | William Lee Nussbaum, Jr. | wln@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu