Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!bionet!agate!shelby!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: farkas@eng.sun.com (Frank Farkas) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: A Question Message-ID: Date: 29 Nov 90 05:17:58 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Lines: 113 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article , brown@cs.utk.edu (Lance A. Brown) writes: > I had a funny thought while listening to the sermon this morning >during the Lutheran service my wife and I went to. The pastor was >talking about Christ the King Sunday, and Jesus Christ's role on >Judgement Day. > > He said some things that may have surprised some of the people at >the service. Specifically the pastor spoke about how Jesus would >"separate the sheep from the goats" and that the criteria Jesus will >use is one of works, and not faith. Your pastor was 100% correct. In every case judgement is mentioned by the Bible it is always says that we will be judged by our works, or by our fruiths. We don't have a single case where it is said that we will be judged by our faith. How do we reconcile the fact that Paul said that we are save by grace through faith? Faith in the lord Jesus Christ is the one which makes it possible for us to do good works. So, faith is essential for our salvation, however, if we have no good works then we have dead faith, and we are just fooling ourselfs. I guess an all knowing God would know better then anyone else that words and intentions without actions is nothing but hot air. I recommend for your reading James 2:14-26. > > Thinking about it, this would mean that many people who have never >stepped into a christian church would be among the sheep and many who >went to church each Sunday and gave 5% of the income yearly, etc. >would be set among the goats. > > This led me to what I believe is a possible contradiction (just >one?!?!) in the christian doctrine. It seems really weird to me that >"God" would create the human race with free will, punish us for >dis-obeying him, offer salvation if we "choose" to return to him, and >then basically discard everyone else. This seems really arrogant and >callous to me. > > Also, what happens to the people who are NOT explicitly christian, >but still live lives that "qualify" them for salvation on judgement >day? Are they also relegated to damnation because they did not >"choose" God and Christ? > > You are one of the few who ask the question, how does a theological believe reflect on the character of God? You are on the right road, and you are not too far from the kingdom of God. It is absolutely amazing to me how many of us accept believes which makes a devil out of God. What I am going to tell you is LDS doctrin and I show you that it is supported by the Bible. 1. No person will go to hell who didn't have the opportunity to hear and to respond to the gospel of Jesus Christ. Those who didn't have the opportunity in this world will have it in the spirit world. Peter told us that the gospel is preached in the spirit world, and for the reason it is done: I Peter 3:18-19 =============== "For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:" "By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;" I Peter 4:6 ----------- "For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit." 2. There is more than one heaven. Paul said that he went up to the third heaven, which implies that there are at least three heavens. He also said that the resurrection of the dead will differ in glory. Jesus himself said that there are many mentions in his Father's house. 2 Corint 12:3 ============= "I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I can't tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such a one caught up to the third heaven." I Corint 15:41-42 ================= "There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory. So also the resurrection of the dead. ..." John 14:2 ========= "In my fathers house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go prepare a place for you." >I know the above has not been stated as well as it could be, but I am >not very much of a writer and cannot do any better. > > Lance > >-- >------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Lance A. Brown brown@cs.utk.edu >3500 Sutherland Avenue, Apt. L-303 Graduate Student in Computer Science >Knoxville, TN 37919 Sun SparcStations are Neat! >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- With brotherly love, Frank