Path: utzoo!censor!geac!torsqnt!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!mcsun!hp4nl!charon!piring.cwi.nl!jack From: jack@cwi.nl (Jack Jansen) Newsgroups: comp.arch Subject: Re: Is programming still allowed? Message-ID: Date: 3 Dec 90 15:59:19 GMT References: <8319@star.cs.vu.nl> <531@newave.UUCP> <2140@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> <2524@wn1.sci.kun.nl> Sender: news@cwi.nl Lines: 45 ge@wn3.sci.kun.nl (Ge' Weijers) writes: >.> In article <8319@star.cs.vu.nl> sater@cs.vu.nl (Hans van Staveren) writes: >.> > Is it reasonable to assume that if you buy computer hardware from a >.> > supplier that the information needed to program that hardware should be >.> > available to you? >There is only one way to solve this problem: vote with your budgets. >No specs, no sale. And then wait for the hassle. The only way to be sure that you get sources or specs is to have it in the sales contract *in writing*. Salesman waving hands and telling you everything will be fine are not to be trusted. Even then, I know of various vendors that will try their best to get out of the obligation, and do everything in their power to postpone the delivery of sources or specs [no names, just in case our experiences aren't representative]. Credit where credit is due: Digital is the one exception that I know of. They do take a looooooong time before delivering sources (mainly due to zillions of burocrats in between our contact here in Holland and the people who actually have to sign things and send tapes in the US, I've been told), but when they do you get the latest stuff, even though that might be newer than what you paid for. Moreover, what you get is as complete as can be: standalone stuff etc all included. (with the exception of things that they can't distribute because they aren't theirs, like the mips compilers, etc) Also, note that many vendors aren't interested in this sort of customers anymore: the research market isn't that big, and most of that market will be satisfied as soon as they can write a scsi or vme controller to hook up their experiment. The days that many people were building custom hardware to plug into their pdp-11 are gone.... -- -- Een volk dat voor tirannen zwicht | Oral: Jack Jansen zal meer dan lijf en goed verliezen | Internet: jack@cwi.nl dan dooft het licht | Uucp: hp4nl!cwi.nl!jack -- -- Een volk dat voor tirannen zwicht | Oral: Jack Jansen zal meer dan lijf en goed verliezen | Internet: jack@cwi.nl dan dooft het licht | Uucp: hp4nl!cwi.nl!jack Brought to you by Super Global Mega Corp .com