Xref: utzoo alt.folklore.computers:7700 comp.misc:10746
Path: utzoo!utgpu!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!apple!julius.cs.uiuc.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!mintaka!ogicse!milton!Tomobiki-Cho!mrc
From: mrc@Tomobiki-Cho.CAC.Washington.EDU (Mark Crispin)
Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,comp.misc
Subject: Re: MULTICS and the Jargon File
Message-ID: <12392@milton.u.washington.edu>
Date: 5 Dec 90 22:53:39 GMT
References: <1YfTW4#8MK9Xf8YJtZH970VXl0fFB3R=eric@snark.thyrsus.com> <1990Dec3.193049.8771@sctc.com> <12248@milton.u.washington.edu> <1YgzZ0#1bb89X3cQmgD00tBfF8KX0N9=eric@snark.thyrsus.com>
Sender: news@milton.u.washington.edu
Organization: Mendou Zaibatsu, Tomobiki-Cho, Butsumetsu-Shi
Lines: 57

In article <1YgzZ0#1bb89X3cQmgD00tBfF8KX0N9=eric@snark.thyrsus.com> eric@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond) writes:
>I'm considering it. My problem is that while the PDP-10 isn't quite dead,
>it and a lot of the PDP-10 derived slang are no longer alive *in hackerdom*.

So what?  A lot of the slang in the original jargon file was already
old or out of use.  The entire reason for the jargon file was (1) to
document the extant slang, (2) to preserve the older terms.  You
should not presume to put yourself in the position of deciding that
something should be forgotten.

>Eh? I've been told that, leaving out the odd university relic and that
>museum piece in Sweden, there are exactly *two* active PDP-10 sites left
>and one of them is CompuServe.

BULLSHIT.

I don't know where you got your information from, but that is totally
wrong.

Are you aware that every DEC-20 is a PDP-10?  PDP-10 refers to the
CPU; a DEC-20 is a PDP-10 running TOPS-20.

>Again, this runs counter to what I think I know. When you consider that
>EMACS has propagated to a lot of different varieties of those UNIX boxen
>out there, I doubt it's true.

Much of the commercial world refuses to run EMACS because it is
"inefficient", but are happily TECOing to this day.

> I relegated TECO to the Appendix because
>at this point it's something hackers tell war stories about but don't
>*use*.

Again, bullshit.  There is quite an active TECO user's group at DECUS.

>My decision: it now reads `MESS-DOS' (accurately reflecting current hackish
>sentiment) but I have added a parenthetical note to the effect that ITS fans
>used to say this of UNIX.

You should not presume to make such a decision without consultation
and agreement with the others who worked on it before you.  The Jargon
file is community property, yes; but that does not give you or anyone
ownership rights to it.

The PDP-10 community was (and is) much bigger than ITS.  Something
like 5,000 systems were built.  Don't jump to erroneous conclusions.

I feel that you've done a lot of good work, but please do not go
charging off deciding that something is "no longer important".

 _____   | ____ ___|___   /__ Mark ("Gaijin") Crispin "Gaijin! Gaijin!"
 _|_|_  -|- ||   __|__   /  / R90/6 pilot, DoD #0105  "Gaijin ha doko?"
|_|_|_|  |\-++-  |===|  /  /  Atheist & Proud         "Niichan ha gaijin."
 --|--  /| ||||  |___|    /\  (206) 842-2385/543-5762 "Chigau. Omae ha gaijin."
  /|\    | |/\| _______  /  \ FAX: (206) 543-3909     "Iie, boku ha nihonjin."
 / | \   | |__|  /   \  /    \MRC@CAC.Washington.EDU  "Souka. Yappari gaijin!"
Hee, dakedo UNIX nanka wo tsukatte, umaku ikanaku temo shiranai yo.


Brought to you by Super Global Mega Corp .com