Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: YZKCU@cunyvm.bitnet (Yaakov Kayman) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Whose misinterpretations? (Re: Millenium?) Message-ID: Date: 6 Dec 90 08:38:44 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center Lines: 70 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article , wagner@karazm.math.uh.edu (David Wagner) says: > > ... are found in Jewish misinterpretations of the >Messianic prophecies. Ah! An accusation of misinterpretation from one to whom the Torah was never given and for whom it was never intended. How amusing! The Torah and its interpretation (the Oral Law) were given only to the Jews. See Deut. 33:4 and Ps. 147:19,20. > In some prophecies, the Messiah was portrayed as a >conquering king, a glorious ruler, whose kingdom would last forever. In >others, He was portrayed as a humble, suffering servant, who would be >wounded, spit upon, and rejected by men. With all due respect to your right as members of a faith completely dif- ferent and separate from my own to believe otherwise, the 53rd chapter of Isaiah refers not to any individual, but rather to my people, the Jews, who have been villified (and still are? no?) by the Nations of the World. There is nothing in what Christians call the "O.T." (a term somewhat offensive to Jews) to suggest that Messiah will be "wounded, spit upon, and rejected by men" as my people, the Jews, certainly have been by other nations. > This contrast was so sharp that >some Jews thought there would be two Messiahs, one a political ruler, and >the other a priest from the tribe of Levi who would suffer. There never has been a contention from within the ranks of practicing Jews that there would ever be a messiah from the tribe of Levi. > This in spite >of Zechariah's prophecy, "He shall be a priest upon his throne," which >showed the Messiah to be both priest and king. Only figuratively a priest, not literally at all. > > Other Jews, perhaps most of them, and certainly most that live today, >ignored the prophecies of the suffering Messiah (Isaiah 53 in particular) >and focused on the prophecies concerning the Messiah as king. As I have said above, Isaiah 53 does not refer to Messiah. I will be happy to post to this group a list of all occurrences of the word "ser- vant" (Hebrew: 'eved) in the book of Isaiah, probably a good deal happier than your moderator might be to see such a list posted. :-) It's not that we Jews have "ignored" this "prophecy." We have denied it, and continue to deny it. >David H. Wagner Yaakov K. -------- Yaakov Kayman (212) 903-3666 City University of New York BITNET: YZKCU@CUNYVM "Lucky is the shepherd, and lucky his flock Internet: YZKCU@CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU about whom the wolves complain" [The picture of a political messiah and a priestly messiah from Levi is from the Testament of the Twelve Patriarchs. It used to be thought that this might be a Christian interpolation, but the text was found in Qumran in a pre-Christian document. The same view is given in some of the Qumran documents themselves, 1 QS and 1 QSa. (This is all from Fuller's book "The Foundations of NT Christology.") While it certainly doesn't represent what is now mainstream Judaism, the Qumran community was certainly a group of practicing Jews. In the 1st Cent. (as now) there was an amazing amount of variety in views about the future. --clh]