Path: utzoo!censor!geac!torsqnt!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!usc!apple!agate!ucbvax!LSUVM.BITNET!$CSD211 From: $CSD211@LSUVM.BITNET (Mark Orr) Newsgroups: comp.sys.apple2 Subject: Re: Building a NEW computer Message-ID: <9012090428.AA16099@apple.com> Date: 9 Dec 90 03:52:46 GMT References: Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU Organization: The Internet Lines: 57 |From: randy hyde |To address the other questions of 6502 shortcomings: keep in mind that |the 65xxx family is a family of controller chips, not general purpose |CPUs. It doesn't support MUL and DIV or (heaven forbid!) floating pont |because the applications (i.e., Nintendo) where the chip was destined |don't require it. They need something cheap. MUL, DIV, and FP cost |money! Apple II (and especially Apple //gs) users think their machines |drive the CPU development. DEAD WRONG! Apple has only sold a couple |hundred thousand GS machines. Compare that to the millions of Nintendoes |sold. Apple has sold more than a million IIgs's. The IIgs was for a while (late 86 early 87, just after it was released) a very hot selling item (despite short- ages of the Ensoniq chip). The Apple II series was not the only one to use the 6502...remember the Atari 400/600/800/1200/XL's and XE's (probably a couple of million of those), and the Commodore PETs and VIC-20s (a million or so more), and the BBC micro (more millions), the Rockwell KIM/SYM/AIM (a few hundred thousand), not to mention other sundry no-names. I really doubt that machines like the Nintendo were the "intended market." To say that MOSTEK didn't have computers in mind when they put together the 6502 is just silly. Compared to the chips of the day (8080s, 6800s) the 6502 looks deluxe. Now the chip you also mentioned, the 6809 (used in Stellation Two's MILL and VitaMILL) was a really nice chip...too bad it was wasted on a veg-o-matic like the Radio Shack Color Computer. Yeah, MUL, DIV and FP instructions cost money...But show me another personal computer (built now) based on a CPU without divide and multiply. To say that these instructions have no use on a computer (even a Nintendo) is goofy. Try doing rapid coordinate transforms without 'em. |If you want to run UNIX, buy a Next (if you're a student) or an AMIGA |(if you're not a student). The 65xxx family just doesn't have enough |get up and go to support UNIX. Better yet, scoot on over to the |comp.sys.nsc32k group and order a PC532 board (32532 CPU). Now that's |a great UNIX chip. |*** RAndy Hyde O-) Any of you seen the new Amiga 3000UX. Comes with UNIX system V release 4, X windows and Open Look...it easily outperforms the old NeXT (pre '040s), and it has all the AMIGA custom hardware (so much for Jobs' "mainframe power on two chips). UNIX could be run on an Apple II...with a coprocessor card. Say, if a card with a Inmos T400 or AMD 29000 were added, along with higher-resolution graphics. (the old Saybrook and PDQ II coprocessors (68000s) ran versions of UNIX, but of course they're long gone). If we formed a company to build a renegade II, with the coprocessor built in...Hey, who knows? ---------------------------------- | MARK A. ORR | "Eww...I'm so mad, I'm gonna get in my | $CSD211 @ LSUVM.SNCC.LSU.EDU | Lincoln Town Car and lean on the gas | @ LSUVM.BITNET | 'till I get to West Virginiaaaaa" ---------------------------------- - Larry Bud Melman