Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!sdd.hp.com!wuarchive!mit-eddie!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: billy@tcom.stc.co.uk (Billy Khan) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: Missed Point Message-ID: Date: 14 Dec 90 08:53:14 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: STC New Southgate, London N11 1HB Lines: 72 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu Hi....don't know your name! > Why can't everybody just realise that Jesus was just an ordinary, > albeit very ahead of his time,person who had a lot of brilliant > ideas about how we should live? I appreciate the objection! It has been said that Jesus was a man born five thousand years ahead of his time, i used to think that myself. Trouble with that view is this. Jesus was a normal human being, in every way. He had a human mum, grew up as a human kid, did a normal job until he was in his thirties. The difference was that he was the son of God. Jesus could have had all his super amazing Godly powers if he had wanted them. But he came to earth as a human so we could relate to him so much better. If you read the bible, all the miracles that he performed, he prayed to God about first, he didn't do them through his own power. He was just as human as you and I. > There is absolutly no need to bring in god,heaven or anything like > that to explain anything,and anybody who does was either brainwashed > by their parents or else are too ignorant to think objectivly about their > religion. No need to bring god or heaven in? From your previous pargraph I would say that you accepted that jesus existed (whatever your views on who he was). There are plenty of documented miracles (apart from the bible... mainly the Romans). Personnally I would like to see a man, who gets beaten up so bad that not even his mum could recognise him, gets whipped with a vicious roman style whip til most of his back is gone, has to lug a massive cross halfway up a hill, then gets nailed to it, hung for a few hours, has a spear stuck in his side, gets wrapped in loads of clothe and put in a tomb for three days, and still manages to get up and walk around afterwards without the power of God with him. I am thinking objectively and the object is Jesus! You might think I've been brainwashed, I've been called worst things! Christianity transcends intelligence. I have three A-levels and am studying a degree( no brag intended, I am just trying to prove a point), i am not ignorant or stupid, but Christianity is beyond intellectual examination, you can debate it as much as you want. > I remember one of my many religious instructors in school once gave > a very cutting address against people like the dreaded 'Moonies' > and 'Born Again Christians' who kidnap people unbeknowns to them > and brainwash them for a couple of weeks into their way of thinking. You won't like the answer to this one! Its a bit heavy! Write back if you are prepared to listen to a spritual answer. The short answer is...'If you were some one who was trying their hardest to stop people becoming christians, wnat would you do?' Suffice to say that no born again Christians are brainwashed or forced into anything, you can't force someone to love someone can you? My parents made me go to church every sunday, I hated it. Going to church isn't Christianity at all. I didn't become a Christian until a few months back. Many people get the wrong idea of christianity from being dragged along to church at an early age, though this isn't always true. > Objective replies will be appreciated.... Bit hard to be objective with infinite objects. Hope this helps, any questionS, feel free to write back on the net.... Drew. "...Go to church now, and beat the Christmas rush...!" [If you meant that there is Roman documentation for Jesus' miracles you are wrong. There are no records of Jesus' life outside Christian writings. There are of course Roman records quoting what Christians believed. --clh]