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From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Nur Iskandar Taib)
Newsgroups: sci.military
Subject: Re: Hartmann and Marseille
Message-ID: <1990Dec17.044808.25788@cbnews.att.com>
Date: 17 Dec 90 04:48:08 GMT
References: <1990Dec11.015903.26972@cbnews.att.com> <1990Dec12.031305.10254@cbnews.att.com>
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From: ntaib@silver.ucs.indiana.edu (Nur Iskandar Taib)

*> (Of Erich Hartmann:)
*>In fact, he was shot down 16 times and bailed out twice (ref: Edward H.
*>Sims's "The Greatest Aces"), and in fact he was captured (briefly) once.
*>However, my statement still stands:  he was never hurt, and never lost
*>a wingman (although he once came close, when a very inexperienced wingman
*>had to bail out).  He was also proud of the fact that not once was his
*>aircraft hit by fire from an enemy fighter -- all his losses were to
*>ground fire or bomber defensive guns.

Well, the last time he bailed out, it
was due to being surrounded by a half
dozen of so Mustangs. Realizing he was 
either going to be shot down or run out 
of gas, he opted to bail out. 



*>> N.B.: IMHO, the best aerial shooter was Hans Joachim Marseille, who, with only
*>>152 kills was much lower on the totem pole, typically used only 10 or so
*>>*shells* per kill, and often came back from his flights( over N Africa) with
*>>7-10 kills. Cited by both sides as the greatest off angle shooter.


He was also unorthodox in not always 
fighting at full throttle. Sometimes 
he'd cut the trottle and extend the 
flaps to turn inside his opponent. 







-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib                        | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: NTAIB@AQUA.UCS.INDIANA.EDU |    Frog is Frog ala Peach
Bitnet:   NTAIB@IUBACS               !