Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!bonnie.concordia.ca!uunet!ora!daemon From: jdravk@speech2.cs.cmu.edu (Jeanette Dravk) Newsgroups: soc.feminism Subject: Re: Power economics, genders, and the status quo Message-ID: <1991Jan14.202716.18080@ora.com> Date: 14 Jan 91 20:27:16 GMT References: <9101141526.AA28821@easynet.crl.dec.com> Sender: ambar@ora.com (Jean Marie Diaz) Organization: Barbie's Dream Dungeon Lines: 95 Approved: ambar@ora.com In article <9101141526.AA28821@easynet.crl.dec.com> baranski@meridn.enet.dec.com (Jim Baranski) writes: >In article <9101072114.AA06178@rutgers.edu>, jdravk@speech2.cs.cmu.edu (Jeanette Dravk) writes... >>"Now this group had originally been founded 120 years ago as a German >>men's choir, and has since grown to include 3000 male members of the >>political/social/business scene in Erie... > ... Why resort >>to laws that can be gotten around and take time and money to pursue >>when the means of making the "female membership" clause a reality >>already exists? It exists because women today have something that >>women of thirty years ago did not have to such an extent: economic >>power. Clubs have expenses to pay, bills to met and members to keep >>happy in order for them to continue to exist. Among other things, >>this club hires it's building out for weddings, bingo games and other >>community affairs. Not to mention the fact that women are not by >>*any* means excluded from entering the club with a member, i.e. a man. >>So now what would happen if all of a sudden the wives, girl friends, >>and other female relatives of club members refused to enter that >>building? What if women refused to be married there? What if women >>refused to attend dances and bingo games there?" >All these courses of action were available 120 years ago. What makes >the difference is not that women have the almighty dollar, but that >they have the gumption to take a stand. How many of these activities >do you think the women attending are actually shelling out the green >stuff? Not the majority. Hmm... let's see ... Most community centers I would estimate probably (but I'm not sure) can't be hosting more than about say ... 2 wedding receptions a month [on average that is] ... in which case the rental fee of X dollars is given to the club and the catering fee of Y dollars is probably given to an outside caterer -- probably the X amount is a flat rental fee for use of the space. So let's mark up 2X dollars a month from weddings [paid for by whatever arrangement -- I can't say, since it's an individual decision that's been going through a lot of change lately ...] What else? Bingo -- bingo [in my humble experience] is usually a regular thing [i.e. 4 times a week] so we'll give that the 4X amount. Meals. Yes, these are probably paid for by members -- obviously. I certainly wouldn't want to pay for dinner at a club/restaurant that wouldn't let me in as a member. I can't put a price on that relative to the X amount already mentioned, so for the sake of keeping apples and oranges separate, I'm ignoring it. And finally, dances. Here again, there's a flat fee... I'd say there's usually a dance maybe once a month so give it X too. Now, I know for a *fact* that bingo meets are almost *exclusively* women and I'm sure they're the ones paying for it... unless you want to tell me that the majority of women who attend bingo games are using money from "allowances" they get from men... so there's quite a bit of money the club gets *directly* from women's pockets... at 4 times a month no less! Weddings and meals I've already noted -- I think I agree that it's the majority of men who pay for meals there -- and as for weddings, well, that's something a parental team usually takes care of -- i.e. split down the middle for a 50/50 deal. Finally, dances. Now here is something interesting. I have absolutely no idea what the deal is between teen-aged men and women who go to dances. I know that I almost *always* paid for the tickets when I took a guy... and I also bought dinner half the time as well! From what I've heard from my younger sister this trend is still going on, but I'm sure it's different everywhere. So I think if you go back and look, you'll see that women are putting a very sizable chunk of money into this club.... about (.90)(4)(X) = $3.6X/month from women playing bingo about (.50)(2)(X) = $X/month from women whose children are getting married and womn paying for meals [tentative] about (.40)(2)(X) = $.8X/month from women going to dance. for a grand total of about 5.4 times the rental fee for the club per month. I recognize that behavior patterns have also changed a lot, and that that is another reason why this sort of boycott wouldn't have worked 30 years ago but I still contend that this club also has a substantal monetary interest in keeping women coming to the club. Substantial enough that the loss of it would seriously damage the club's finances.... Which was my whole point. j- -- #*#*#*#*#*# Transient Creature of the Wide, Wild World #*#*#*#*#*#*#* "Time is not linear to me, it is a nebulous web of existential freedom."