Path: utzoo!censor!geac!torsqnt!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: mib@geech.ai.mit.edu (Michael I Bushnell) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: Why a New Testament? Message-ID: Date: 24 Jan 91 08:56:38 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: Free Software Foundation, Cambridge, MA Lines: 97 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article usul@auc.UUCP (Ron McBay) writes: Why was it necessary for there to be a New Testament? Because, with the Incarnation, there was "new knowledge" posessed by the world about God and the way God works. As the first Christians thought about what they had seen, they wrote down their thoughts, which became normative for the church as a whole. Was the message that God gave to the Jews incomplete? In a sense, yes, and in another sense, no. The New Testament explains some things on which the Old Testament is silent, and modifies understanding of others. The Bible cannot contain all possible true statements no matter how big it is, for truth is infinite. As a result, any book will be incomplete. Protestants generally believe that the Bible contains all that is necessary for salvation, Catholics would add the magisterium of the church to that, and Eastern Orthodox believers would add the traditions of the universal church. In the sense that more had yet to be said, the message to the Jews was incomplete. In the sense that it was the appropriate revelation at the time, it was complete. For example, a Jew could be asked why the revelations through the prophets were necessary. Was not the revelation to Moses complete? The situation is analogous. Did new times require a different message? The New Testament is not fundamentally understood as a revelation, or as a message from God. Rather, it is Christ that is the message, the revelation, and the New Testament is our standard for interpreting and understanding that event. (Again, Catholics and Eastern Orthodox believers would modify that sentence approriately.) Christ is typically seen as a message to all times, not just the time to come after Jesus died. Christians usually affirm that the reality of Christ lay behind the rituals of the temple cult and the statements and promises of the prophets. Do Christians believe that Christ's message in the New Testament applies to the Jews also, or does it only apply to Gentiles? Actually, we usually believe that it was addressed to the Jews and made available to the Gentiles. The Epiphany is the unveiling of God for the entire world, and this became possible through the incarnation. If the New Testament also applies to the Jews, then what did the Jews do wrong that required Christ to come and deliver a new message? Nothing more than that which led to Isaiah, Jeremiah, and the rest of the prophets. At the same time, Jesus is the fulfilment of the prophetic tradition, and the precursor to it. His message is the same as that as the prophets, radicalized and clarified. If the New Testament does not apply to the Jews, how do you reconcile the same God requiring two different modes of behavior from two separate groups? First, note that the New Testament was written by people who called themselves Jews. Acts claims that the apostles worshipped daily in the Temple. The New Testament is not about rules for behavior, nor about which rules apply to which people. It applies to all people in the sense that Christians hold it to be universally true, but the moral "commands" in the New Testament are not to be understood as permanently binding rules. They are explications of the gospel in particular circumstances. Why aren't Christians required to keep kosher if the same God (i.e., the God of Abraham), told the Jews to do so? Our Jewish friends would be happy to point out here that the Law of Moses was given to the Jews, and not to all humanity. The Christian message is of liberation from law, not a different law. Jewish Christians in the early church, however, did largely keep the law. (Paul is the only notable exception.) They did not consider themselves free from being Jewish, and considered themselves Jewish. I have never been able to understand how Christians (and Moslems) can believe that the same God delivers separate messages to the Jews, Christians and Moslems. It seems to me that there should be one truth that applies to all people for all time. Christians believe, generally, that the message given to the Jews was from God, and intended for the Jews, but is informative to all of us about the nature of God and the history of divine interaction with people. Islam, as I understand it, holds that the revelations to the Jews and through Jesus are equally valid today, but that Jews and Christians have modified ("perverted" is the word in my translation of the Qu'ran) the original message, so that it is barely recognizable in the Pentateuch and the gospels. -mib