Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!bonnie.concordia.ca!nstn.ns.ca!wrdis01!gatech!ncar!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!apple!voder!pyramid!athertn!Atherton.COM!dlw From: dlw@Atherton.COM (David Williams) Newsgroups: comp.sys.next Subject: Re: Fwd: Hewlett-Packard - Sun Microsystems Message-ID: <34541@athertn.Atherton.COM> Date: 27 Feb 91 20:25:29 GMT References: <1991Feb26.192759.3442@news.nd.edu> Sender: news@athertn.Atherton.COM Reply-To: dlw@Atherton.COM (David Williams) Organization: Atherton Technology -- Sunnyvale, CA Lines: 87 In article <1991Feb26.192759.3442@news.nd.edu>, mahesh@caradhras.cc.nd.edu (Mahesh Subramanya) writes: In article , haroldt@paralandra.yorku.ca (Harold Tomlinson) writes: |> |> In article dc4f+@andrew.cmu.edu (Daniel Crimmins) writes: |> |> > this is pinched from the dow jones newswire. notice any workstation |> > vendors of interest missing from this list? |> > |> > --dan. |> |> > Actually, this is quite interesting. While I was at USENIX, I >got into a rather long discussion with a senior developer from HP. This >was during a beerfest at the Pencom suite, so the details are sort of >hazy, but it seems that some folks at HP are basically rewriting the >whole NewWave environment in C, and are porting it to pretty much >any machine that will take it. This includes Suns, Decs, 6000s, etc. Well they'll port it after they finish it. Basically Distributed NewWave is at its core, just Apollo NCS 2.0. It will be trivial to port it to other unix platforms once it is completed. >The intention I believe is to make the whole NewWave environment (which is >rather more than just a user interface. Theres also the whole concept of >"agents" etc. etc.) available in a network independent && machine independent >form. The n/w independence comes from the factthat NewWave agents will >just as willingly access resources from a remote machine as a local one. >(can you say "mach ports" anyone??). Yes, but what will this provide above and beyond what one already has with nfs, sockets, Sun RPC and NCS 1.5? There is a notion of "presentation semantic split..but NewWave has no standard imaging model....like say Display PostScript. Imagine you have an compound "object"--say a document with a spreadsheet in it. The document was created locally on your local nextstation via WriteNow and the spreadsheet component was created and included from an HP pc clone which resides in London England. NewWave could let you access the sub object on the PC in London, but there is no provision for how you would view the "PC created" image on your nextstation. Consider the reverse a humble PC user somewhere on an internet who has a document which contains or references a PostScript object created and kept on a NeXTStation--if the PC does not have Display PostScript HOW will this user see or interact with this object? Perhaps HP will adapt DP as their standard imaging model as I lobbied when I worked in the architecture lab at HP for Distributed NewWave. > Theres a long list of features, etc., which I wont go into, but >a point which this chappie made which was quite memorable was >" I don't give a damn whether Sun, IBM or HP end up as king of the Hill. >What we ought to watch out for is MicroSoft. As long as some flavour In the PC arena HP has already lost the battle. Windows 3.0 while not having the functionality of DOS/NewWave is its competitor. MicroSoft has already won in terms of sales and installed base in terms of DOS/NewWave vs Windows 3. They are already cast FUD in terms of their direction for OOFS and how it would do what NewWave does. On the DOS front HP is at the mercy of MicroSoft as they depend on it for the OS (such as it is) and on Windows itself. >of UNIX takes it, its cool, but *me*? I want to bury those F**kers at >Microsoft!!" It will take more than just HP to bury MicroSoft. Bill Gates is a stud and his company is software killing machine. Look what they're planning to do to Go and its new product with PenWindows. Apple had to reign Claris back in to counter MicroSofts dominance on its platform. IBM can't even handle the boys from Redmond. As long as the idiots at OSF & Unix International keep whining at one another MicroSoft will rule the marketplace. Can HP and SunSoft succeed in this endeavor? Only time will tell. >A sentiment which I heartily echo.... Yeah, we're safe as long as NeXTStations/Cubes stay MicroSoft free. -- David Williams --------------------------------------------------------------------- #define flame_sheild "I know you are, but what am I?" --------------------------------------------------------------------- David Williams -- dlw@atherton.com -- (408) 734-9822 x291 Atherton Technology -- The CASE Repository/IPSE 1333 Bordeaux Drive Sunnyvale, CA 94089 AIX,SunOS,Ultrix,VMS *