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From: allender@cs.uiuc.edu (Mark Allender)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.misc
Subject: Re: A sad day...
Message-ID: <1991Mar7.221241.18977@m.cs.uiuc.edu>
Date: 7 Mar 91 22:12:41 GMT
References: <46878@nigel.ee.udel.edu>
Sender: news@m.cs.uiuc.edu (News Database (admin-Mike Schwager))
Reply-To: allender@cs.uiuc.edu (Mark Allender)
Organization: TechoPunks Ltd. -- Party Goers to the Max
Lines: 67

In article <46878@nigel.ee.udel.edu>, johnston@oscar.ccm.udel.edu (Bill Johnston) writes:

> The programming effort that led to the Mac OS cost alot of money 
> that was rolled into the cost of every Mac.  It can be argued (weakly) 
> that Mac OS was based on the Xerox Star interface (Apple PAID to use it),
> but WINDOWS is inarguably based on the Macintosh OS.

HUH??  I don't think that the connection between Star and the Mac is weak at
all.  I don't believe that it is any more weak than between Mac and Windows.
A windowing environment is a fairly intuitive kind of idea.  Icons...the same
can be said.  Star has these.  So apple paid for it.  Big deal.  Then maybe
MicroSoft should be paying money to Xerox.


> Why should Apple give it away?  I gladly paid a premium to use a 
> machine with a well-designed operating system.  Why should my
> dollars support Windows?

An idea is not given away.  Ideas come from many different places.  The idea
of using windows in an OS, as stated earlier, is intuitive at the least (IMHO).
These "look and feel" lawsuits are going to set a dangerous precendence.

> Why the hell haven't PC-users gotten together and demanded more
> DOS from Microsoft for your money?  After you've invested blood,
> sweat and tears in all the add-in boards and "hidden costs"
> required to make a PC work like a Mac, why are you complaining
> to Apple instead of IBM?

I have NEVER wanted my PC to work like a Mac.  I actually cringe at the thought.
If I did, then I would have bought a Mac.  If I invest my money into an operating
system, and a computer, and a vendor brings forth a windowing environment, then
I will damn well use it.  I can see where Apple comes of saying that microsoft
copied the "idea" from them.  But, again, this is a dangerous precedent.  Let's
say Apple wins the case in the long run.  I will bet that you will see a host of
lawsuits following in which Company A says, "We had idea X, and used it in our
system, and then Company B copied it."  The sanctity of the software world is now
in jepordy.  No one will be able to write anything without having to check first
whether or not someone else had the same idea.  Can Origin systems say, "Well,
the Ultima series are adventure games, and Sierra's King Quest series is a spinoff
of our ideas, so we are going to sue them."  (Maybe not a great example, but the
underlying theme is the same.)  There will be no more original software.  One of the
things that I have always felt good about being in the software industry is the
fact that I can write software that takes someone elses idea and improves on it.

At least in my world of being, people are usually glad when I send them a fix or
upgrade to their program.  This is an integral part of the software engineering
world.  That is what makes it unique.  We all learn.  Admitadly, we are now talking
about millions of dollars instead of a mere program, but the ideas apply.  People
will still by Macs if apple loses.  People will still buy PC's if Apple wins.  Then
why should the people who want to buy PC's be denied the same user interface that
the Mac has when the interface idea of windows is a good one:  good for development,
good for productivity, and good for the software environment in general.

I feel this is a case of lawyers trying to make more money (and even Apple trying
to make more money).  This is way to dangerous of a precendent.  I shudder to think
of consequences if Apple wins....

> 
> -- Bill Johnston (johnston@oscar.ccm.udel.edu)
> -- 38 Chambers St.; Newark, DE 19711; (302)368-1949 


-- 
-Mark Allender
-University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign
-Conversation Builder Project
-allender@cs.uiuc.edu