Path: utzoo!utgpu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!rpi!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!olivea!oliveb!amdahl!JUTS!duts!kls30 From: kls30@duts.ccc.amdahl.com (Kent L Shephard) Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy Subject: Re: Mac and Amiga (Games--Macintosh vs A500) Message-ID: <08Vj02t8061R01@JUTS.ccc.amdahl.com> Date: 18 Mar 91 21:24:06 GMT References: <4239.27de4b9d@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu> <1991Mar13.234443.2281@mintaka.lcs.mit.edu> <7816@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> <1991Mar14.052507.19830@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> <7906@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> Sender: netnews@ccc.amdahl.com Reply-To: kls30@DUTS.ccc.amdahl.com (PUT YOUR NAME HERE) Organization: Amdahl Corporation, Sunnyvale CA Lines: 130 In article <7906@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> blissmer@expert.cc.purdue.edu (Corey) writes: >They are suing two companies: HP & Microsoft. They are suing over a stolen >look and feel. Commodore and NeXT were not sued, because they _innovated_ when >they wrote their OS. Micosoft saw a good thing and xeroxed (pun intended) it. > NeXT used technology proven by Adobe they did not crate display postscript. Postscript is device independent. It runs on basically any platform from RISC (IBM RS6000) to CISC(NeXT, SUN, DEC). This is taken from the Sept 1989 issue of Computer published by the IEEE. Xerox Star was first to use WYSIWYG, 72 dpi bitmapped display, 1:1 screen ratios. The first to use a desktop metaphor, icons and iconic file management, tiled and overlapping windows, object oriented enviornment. Application consistency was unheard fo until Xerox Star system. Below is a chart (crude) that shows the evolution of window based systems that are taken from Xerox research. Memex _________________|_________________ | | | V V V Simula Reactive Engine NLS Sketchpad \ | | ___|___ / \ | | | | / \ | \ / | / \ | \ / | / \_____ | v v /----|------- | | ____________ Alto__/_____|_______________________ | | | | | | / | || | | | | | | | | |/ | || | | | V V V V | V V V| V V V SRI Smalltalk Bravo | Sil Draw| Flyer Markup Press | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |___+__| | | _______ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |\ V | / \ | | | | | | \ Gypsy | / \ | | | | | | \ | \ ++ \ | +________________ | | | \ | \ / ______+__| | | | | | \/ \ / | \ | | | V V /\ V | V | | | Mesa Pygmalion/ | BravoX | Office Talk | | V | \ / | | | | | Interpress /\ \/ | | / | | | | \ /\ \ | / V | | | \ / \ /\ | / Doodle | | | V / \/ \ | / | | | | Tajo / /\___\__|__/ | V | | (XDE) / / | | Augment | | | / /<--------| | | | | | / V | | | | |<---/ Star<--------------------------------------| | | | (8010) | | | | | | | | | | V |_______ | | | | Lisa | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | V | | | _______________| | Cedar | V | | | | |Macintosh | | V | | | | | Deluxe Paint | | | -------------+------------ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | V | | | V V | Postscript ------------------------> ViewPoint | | | (6085) | | | | V | | | Interleaf | V | | Metaphor | | Workstation | | | | | | | V V MacII ViewPoint 2.0 This what follows is a quote from Byte magazine interview of Lisa designers. Byte: Do you have a Xerox Star here that you work with? Tesler: No, we didn't have one here. We went to the NCC (National Computer Conference) when the Star was announced and looked at it. And in fact it had an immediate impact. A few months after looking at it we made some changes to our user interface based on ideas that we got from it. For example, the desktop manager we had before was completely different; it didn't use icons at all, and we never liked it very much. We decided to change our to icon based. That was probably the only thing we got from Star, I think most of our Xerox inspiration was Smalltalk rather than Star. Also Steve Jobs admitted to visiting Xerox to take a look at some projects in the early 80's but never lic. anything. >Apple is within their right (and duty) to protect the validity of their >copyright on look and feel. A copyright they should have never received since it was base on work and ideas of others. Apple is full of shit. They don't sue NeXT, Sun, or DEC because they lic. their Postscript stuff from Adobe who pays Xerox. >Can you imagine a world where anyone could make a functional copy of Excel by >analyzing the operation of it and release it as their own program without >innovating. Look at Windows. Use it. Use a mac. Tell me Microsoft innovated. Command structure is one thing like a spreadsheet clone. Look and feel like that of a GUI is something else. Apple didn't innovate by their own admission. They stole the ideas. -- /* -The opinions expressed are my own, not my employers. */ /* For I can only express my own opinions. */ /* */ /* Kent L. Shephard : email - kls30@DUTS.ccc.amdahl.com */