Xref: utzoo comp.sys.amiga.advocacy:1071 comp.sys.mac.misc:9492 Path: utzoo!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!bonnie.concordia.ca!ccu.umanitoba.ca!herald.usask.ca!alberta!aunro!aupair.cs.athabascau.ca!atha!decwrl!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!cunixf.cc.columbia.edu!cunixb.cc.columbia.edu!es1 From: es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.misc Subject: Re: Mac and Amiga (Games--Macintosh vs A500) Message-ID: <1991Mar14.003252.27833@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu> Date: 14 Mar 91 00:32:52 GMT References: <91MAR12.134551@ducvax.auburn.edu> <1991Mar13.131004.9647@sugar.hackercorp.com> <1991Mar13.221028.8703@neon.Stanford.EDU> Sender: usenet@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (The Network News) Reply-To: es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) Organization: Columbia University Lines: 95 Nntp-Posting-Host: cunixb.cc.columbia.edu In article <1991Mar13.221028.8703@neon.Stanford.EDU> torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie) writes: >peter@sugar.hackercorp.com (Peter da Silva) writes: > >>In article <91MAR12.134551@ducvax.auburn.edu> cs220x2a@ducvax.auburn.edu writes: >>> 3) Apple comes out with more innovative products than any other computer >>> company. > >>The last innovative product that came out of Apple... let's see. How about the >>original Macintosh? What have they done since then that wasn't just putting >>faster chips in the same basic box? > > What happens if you apply the exact same reasoning to Commodore? >You could say "The last innovative product to come out of Commodore was >the original Amiga. What have they done since then that wasn't just >putting faster chips in the same basic box?" > This discussion is getting unrealistic on both sides. Apple is still coming out with new and good products, but to call the 3 new machines they just came out with "innovative" is ridiculous too. They are step backwards. They are marketing revolutions, not technical revolutions. This isn't to say that they are unimportant, but they are not steps forward. From what I've seen, the System 7.0 font manager is a technical innovation, with the ability to use scalable fonts for all languages with automatic kerning in the OS and the ability to enter text left-to-right, right-to-left and top-to-bottom. Of course, it is well known that Commodore is working actively on Compugraphic support for the Amiga OS as well. > One could argue that Apple has been more innovative than Commodore >over the last 5 years. Apple started off with a monochrome, one-size >monitor non-expandable system. Since then they've added things like >32-bit colour, expansion slots, RISC graphics coprocessors, monitors >of any size you can afford to pay for - and software like Truetype, >Hypercard, Multifinder and even A/UX [which runs old Mac applications >as a task under Unix...something the Amiga can't do comparably with >Amiga applications]. > Yes, but most people don't consider the A/UX to be Unix. I know the arguments, but the final industry decision was against A/UX. Besides A/UX will be truly hurt by the NeXTs (not that Amigas won't be hurt as well). > What has Commodore done in the same period? Amigas still seem to >have the same old colour restrictions, pretty much the same old >resolutions, pretty much the same old graphics chip set. If >anyone's been resting on their haunches putting out incremental >improvements, it's Commodore, not Apple. > Admittedly, over the first appr. 2.5-3 years Commodore floundered. They were coming from the highs of the C=64 and the Amiga wasn't yet a significant entity. Commodore wasn't used to the concept of R&D. Given that, I think it is fair to consider what they've done since then. In 1990, they came out with a whole range of networking hardware and software that follow industry standards. They came out with AmigaVision. They came out with the A3000 and all of its variants. And the A3000 is a significant advance because it comes with a full 32-bit bus running at 25MHz, built in 32-bit SCSI and up to 18MB on the motherboard, as well as a built-in flicker fixer. So far in 1991 they've come out with a deinterlacer for the A2000 line. There is Unix, as well as a Tape-drive system. They will be coming out with CDTV, Workbench 2.0, the University of Lowell board. This is all that we know of. Commodore has placed ads looking for new employees to help with the areas of Device Independant Graphics and scalable fonts, and we already know that they are actively working on new chip sets. So don't count Commodore out. Those are pretty impressive contributions to the state of the Amiga. Commodore is finally working actively on developing the Amiga, I'm hoping that it isn't too late from a marketing perspective. >[Before you flame, read and consider carefully. Ask yourself, "What >has Commodore done over the past 5 years to the Amiga?" ] > This wasn't a flame. 5 years ago there was only the A1000 with 256K, Workbench 1.0 and no software or hardware. I think CBM's come a long way. >-- >------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Evan Torrie. Stanford University, Class of 199? torrie@cs.stanford.edu >"And in the death, as the last few corpses lay rotting in the slimy > thoroughfare, the shutters lifted in inches, high on Poacher's Hill..." -- Ethan Upon leaving office, Ronald Reagan began renting an office in the penthouse of the Fox Plaza, the Los Angeles high-rise used as the location for the terrorist movie "Die Hard".