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From: torrie@cs.stanford.edu (Evan Torrie)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.misc
Subject: Re: Mac and Amiga (Games--Macintosh vs A500)
Message-ID: <1991Mar14.182414.11033@neon.Stanford.EDU>
Date: 14 Mar 91 18:24:14 GMT
References: <91MAR12.134551@ducvax.auburn.edu> <1991Mar13.131004.9647@sugar.hackercorp.com> <1991Mar13.221028.8703@neon.Stanford.EDU> <1991Mar14.003252.27833@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>
Sender: torrie@neon.Stanford.EDU (Evan James Torrie)
Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University, Ca , USA
Lines: 66

es1@cunixb.cc.columbia.edu (Ethan Solomita) writes:

>	This discussion is getting unrealistic on both sides.
>Apple is still coming out with new and good products, but to call
>the 3 new machines they just came out with "innovative" is
>ridiculous too. They are step backwards. 

  Steps sideways perhaps :-), except they did add sound input as
standard (something only NeXTs can otherwise claim to have).  And they
are innovative in their pricing (for Apple at least).

>technical innovation, with the ability to use scalable fonts for
>all languages with automatic kerning in the OS and the ability to
>enter text left-to-right, right-to-left and top-to-bottom. 

  Actually, the left-to-right stuff etc has been in Apple's system for
a number of years via the Script Manager (another Apple innovation)

>	Yes, but most people don't consider the A/UX to be Unix.
>I know the arguments, but the final industry decision was against
>A/UX. 

  Was it?  I guess we'll have to inform the U.S. Govt of that - they
seem to like A/UX a lot.

>with a full 32-bit bus running at 25MHz, built in 32-bit SCSI and

  Is this SCSI-2?  SCSI-1 is an 8-bit protocol.

>up to 18MB on the motherboard, 

  Well, you can put 128MB on the motherboard of a Mac II today... not
that it's really relevant.

>They will be coming out with CDTV, Workbench 2.0, the University
>of Lowell board. 

  CDTV IS innovative - I forgot about that... but it seems to suffer
the age-old Commodore problem of being announced 10 years before it's
ready to ship :-)  
  Look at what Apple is doing this year - first the StyleWriter
ink-jet, plus a whole new range of high speed Laserwriters due later,
System 7.0 (on May 13), 68040 Tower Mac, and at least one notebook Mac.


>>[Before you flame, read and consider carefully.  Ask yourself, "What
>>has Commodore done over the past 5 years to the Amiga?" ]
>>
>	This wasn't a flame. 5 years ago there was only the A1000
>with 256K, Workbench 1.0 and no software or hardware. I think
>CBM's come a long way.

  And 7 years ago, there was only a 128K Mac, System 0.97, Finder 1.0,
no software, definitely no hardware...  Apple has also come a long
way.  
  Neither Commodore nor Apple can be praised for being wildly
innovative in their designs - but then we shouldn't expect them to be
either given that they have to be compatible with their installed
base.  
  When Commodore or Apple break with their Amiga and Macintosh
designs respectively, we'll see what innovation means again.

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Evan Torrie.  Stanford University, Class of 199?       torrie@cs.stanford.edu   
"And remember, whatever you do, DON'T MENTION THE WAR!"